Re: PBM design and formulae - another fresh start

From: markiel@callisto.pas.rochester.edu (Andrew Markiel)

Date: Wed, 07 Jul 1993 06:31:06 +0000

In article <C9r47J.JJH@dcs.ed.ac.uk> gym@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Graham Matthews) writes:
>
>Lets say I told you in the *RULES* that fuel consumption went up exponentially
>over time.

f=A*exp[B*t], where f is fuel, t time, and A and B are arbitrary
constants. You could argue for a t^n dependence in the exponential
with n<>1, but I'd consider that highly non-intuitive.

There, you've told me the formula, and I'm happy. Was it really that
hard? Of course, there's still the constants, but with 2 constants I
only need 3 (f,t) pairs to determine them. And if it's that easy
to figure them out, why don't you just give me the constants too?

Now, to counter other possibilities:

1) There are other factors which apply. OK, tell me how they affect
the fuel consumption too.
2) There's time dependence in the A,B parameters. Bleah. Again this
is quite non-intuitive.
3) The A or B parameters don't have a specific value, but are random
(to represent a realistic uncertainty). Then I already have the exact
formula, or rather, as exact as the designer could tell me. So what's
the problem with giving the formula? Furthermore, through play I will
be able to determine the range of values of A and B, so it seems
reasonable to tell the players this range.
4) The A and B parameters vary in a deterministic way, but the exact
value is hidden from me (i.e., hidden information). Then, to the
players, A and B are essentially random variables obeying some
probability distribution, so this case plays the same as (3), and
the same arguments apply.

(As a side point here, I strongly disagree with a system where any
information which can be discovered in a single game (or for open-
ended games, can be discovered in a short playing time) is hidden
from beginning players. If your intention is that people play one
game to learn how the game works, and then a second serious game,
then why not just give them the information right off, and skip
the introductory game, which will probably be less fun since the
players don't know what's going on. If you really want players to
learn as they go, you should give them more than one game's worth
of learning. Otherwise, people just feel that their first game was
wasted learning things they could have been told.).

>Now without knowing the *EXACT FORMULA* you have narrowed things down
>a lot haven't you. This line that if you don't know the formula you have
>no information to start with is again balderdash!
>
But I do know the formula: you just told it to me. Now, unless you
want to claim that people understand exponential time dependence,
but don't understand f=A*exp[B*t] (i.e., somehow they are unable
to grasp symbolic representation), then you seem to be arguing
exactly my point, that the formulas should be given.

>graham

-Andrew
markiel@callisto.pas.rochester.edu

References

PBM design and formulae - another fresh start
gilette@obsidian.unice.fr (Gilette Serge)
Tue, 06 Jul 1993 12:52:08 +0000
Re: PBM design and formulae - another fresh start
desj@ccr-p.ida.org (David desJardins)
Tue, 06 Jul 1993 14:42:20 +0000
Re: PBM design and formulae - another fresh start
gym@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Graham Matthews)
Tue, 06 Jul 1993 16:23:42 +0000
Re: PBM design and formulae - a fresh start
gym@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Graham Matthews)
Tue, 06 Jul 1993 11:55:13 +0000

Referenced By

PBM design and formulae - another fresh start
gilette@obsidian.unice.fr (Gilette Serge)
Tue, 06 Jul 1993 12:52:08 +0000
Re: PBM design and formulae - another fresh start
desj@ccr-p.ida.org (David desJardins)
Tue, 06 Jul 1993 14:42:20 +0000
Re: PBM design and formulae - another fresh start
gym@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Graham Matthews)
Tue, 06 Jul 1993 16:23:42 +0000
Re: PBM design and formulae - a fresh start
gym@dcs.ed.ac.uk (Graham Matthews)
Tue, 06 Jul 1993 11:55:13 +0000