RE: AG stuff

From: sean <sean@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu>

Date: Fri, 23 Jun 1995 00:00:00 +0000

On 23 Jun 1995, Ryu70 wrote:

> Dave writes:
> >Weapon        Range      Hands     Fatigue         Damage
> >War Flail     Med/Long   2         11              Heavy**
> >Mega Mace     Med        1         20              Incredible**
> >Super Hammer  Med/Long   2         20              "
> >Maul of Titans  Long     2         24              "
> >Lance         Long       2          9              Heavy
> >Huge Shield   Short      1         20              Medium  Prot: 26
>
> >     There may have been others that I am forgetting.  The flail
> >and the Lance were included to give those wpn series a Heavy damage
> >upgrade.  As you can see, major sacrifices would be required to
>
> One qualm I have on these super heavy weapons is that all should be
> 2 handed.  Fatigue 20 on a mega mace but using one hand??? Hmmm...
> let's see...could it be, oh, I don't know....MAUG that this would
> favor??? :) I don't think there should be a heavier shield...again
> fatigue 20 but one handed is a no-no in my opinion.  26 protection...
> oooookay, Dave. :)

I agree with you on this point.  All REAL heavy weapons should be two
handed.  Hmmmm, how about a two handed shield. :)  A better solution to
shield protection is to have magical enhancements that would give more
protection.  Think about it...  How 'large' can a shield really get?  If
it gets too big you couldn't even see around it yourself.  How could you
attack?  You might make a good battering ram though...:)

> There is the possibility of abuse with these super heavy
> weapons....I can forsee an 18 STR starting human design
> who picks up daze later on.  40 STR, mega mace, daze around
> level 10-13.  Cast daze once on Paz.  One swing, one hit,

Mind wall?  That could help a bit.  Also good stam counters the effects
of mind spells rather well.

> Also on adventures where monsters normally outnumber the party,
> there are many side and behind the back attacks that aren't sensed
> and defended against.  One hit from a mega mace from behind to
> someone's head would spell disaster, whereas right now, even a
> Masher Herdling getting a free swing at your back with his great
> axe would mean a serious blow, but not an automatic death blow.

Always a good thing to remember when proposing new game ideas.  The
monsters will have access to the weapons as well!!  Imagine an enlightned
cyclops that decides to use a mega mace with a mega shield!  Might be one
tough cookie! :)

> I would have to disagree with you and Dave on this.  High str designs
> and their heavy weapons do decent against parriers, but most of the time
> do awful against dodgers.

They tend to force the parry aside and damage you anyway.

> Yep, another thing to favor humans. :)  I don't see 'typical' high
> str races like ogres benefitting much from super heavy weapons.
> Humans would benefit greatly, then dwarves next on list.

True, generally ogres end up bezerk and dropping their weapons.  Rather
pointles to carry a mega mace into combat just to drop it and swing away
with your fists instead.

> Perhaps we should push more for 2-3 higher classes of armor instead
> of heavier weapons? :) This would increase length of fights for

GREAT IDEA!!!

> the slow/stupid types and more swings at lower attack percentages
> increases chances to win.  Better solution than same length fight
> but only change would be heavier weapon that does more damage if
> you hit? Of course, with the advent of new heavy armors, everyone
> else would also be wearing it so your normal heavy weapon would
> actually be doing less damage if you hit. :)

I agree with this 100%!  More armor would help out ogres tremendously.
What about stacking armor?  Wearing leather or padded under plate for
added protection?  Might get hot, but it would protect better!

> Garrett writes:
> >It still amazes me how many 1500+ characters do not have Fostil's packs.
>
> Believe me, you guys have it _ALOT_ easier nowadays to get gold and
> items like Fostil's packs than we did. :)  Heck, I remember the good

Well wait a second now...:)  Let me remember correctly. :)  didn't Hugh
make adventuring easier a while back because too many characters were
complaining that they couldn't clear high level adventures?  I think this
is true!  He made adventuring easier so that top characters could go and
clear thoes level 20 skree adventures.  Then, after a few years, the
sights became real easy when compaired to power levels of many
characters.  Mid level characters had begun to clear level 20
adventures.  What happened then???  Adventures became difficult again!
Now a level 14 skree becomes difficult rather than a level 20.  What does
this all mean?  Well, Hugh made adventuring easier, but he did not make
the treasure any less.  So guess what?  Even if the items were not in the
game yet, the gold was!  By the time the items made an appearance, the
upper characters had all sorts of gold to buy many found items such as
scrolls and pouches and the such.
	Now, a 1500-2000 power character, who I might add is now at the
power level that the higher level characters are at now, has to go an a
more difficult adventure, thus getting less gold+less important items.
Sure the upper power characters are more powerful, but the 1500-2000
characters are every bit as powerful as the upper characters were at that
time.  It is just that the 1500-2000 power characters now do not have
access to the same items, gold, and game influence as the 1500-2000 power
characters did then.  Sorry...guess this became a bit of a rant! :)

> old days when we adventured for 25 turns without the advent of Fostils,
> Halles, etc. :)  Nothing that could kill us more than finding a marble
> skunk statue on the 1st encounter.

See above! :)

> NEVER ALLOWED TO ABUSE THE SYSTEM!!! ;) (ain't that right, Dave,
> Mr. 6 Earthy Browns? ;-)  then there's Blanka, and Drackmoor, and

That what happens when elder characters have the gold from the good old
days!:)

> Sxar who is even worse with his earthy browns AND forest greens, and

What was his last offer???  10,000 gold!!  For a forrest green?!  If I
were to combine all my characters gold I still couldn't even come close
to half that gold!  <sigh...>

> countless other elves)  I wonder if a minotaur of all things ever
> got to read an earthy brown scroll?!!!

I don't know of any that did...:(  I always thought that if Hugh were
trying to make scrolls for a particular race to use, then he should make
the language requirements for reading the scroll higher...like a level 5
mino language to read an earthy brown.  This would be tough for a mino
much less any other race!  More likely than not, a mino would end up with it.

Later...
		Sean

References

RE: AG stuff
ryu70@aol.com (Ryu70)
Fri, 23 Jun 1995 00:00:00 +0000