Re: It's about time!

From: tim@leaphome.pelican.org (Tim Franklin)

Date: Mon, 08 Mar 1999 00:00:00 +0000

MadCentral <madcentral@aol.com> wrote:
>>>Obviously if it still has value to you, I'd not suggest that you give it
>away!<<
>
>Hmm.  Well Im no 'hard core' programmer and I wouldnt say that I was.
>My code may be considered 'juvenile' by the big guys.  Even my 'programmers'
>code (yeah, I hire one too) who is far better than I at core code is far behind
>the likes of many professional programmers.
>
>That said, a lot of the big programmers dramatically underestimate
>how long a PBM takes to write and what is involved.  I have a lot of well-paid
>'big time' programmer friends and many a time I've heard that old adage "I
>could knock that out for you in a month."  I always smile and agree politely
>that they could.  I've seen them try a few times too, and I've never once said
>I told you so.
>

I can relate to that.  I've programmed for money, and these days I program
a little for fun.  Working within a project, producing code from formal specs
as part of a team is a whole different world from producing a whole game from
the ground upwards between one or two of you, IME at least.

>PBM code, in my humble opinion, is a growing thing.  We have made each new game
>on the back of old code.  Even Necromancer (and I mean the first version, not
>the second.. current ... one) which had far inferior code to the sort of thing
>we are putting out these days, would still be a *big* boon to any of our
>competitors.  Not so much for the code, but for the code *ideas*.  There are
>elements of our games which I don;t believe *any* other company has
>duplicated... not because they can't... but because they havent thought of it.
>Im not going to elaborate though... that stuff is what keeps us in business.
>

That sounds fair enough.  I was assuming that it was more of a "learn and
move on" kind of process, where code from 5 (or 10 or however many) years
ago was unlikey to be of much value to anyone else.  If the process is, as
you say, one of slow evolution of ideas, I can see code staying valuable for
much longer (if only for the game ideas, not the code).

>>>I don't know about the "modest sum" bit - I have no idea what sort of money
>licenses-to-run and entire games change hands for in the PBM world.<<
>
>Oh it varies dramatically.  I've had people offer to sell me whole
>games and all the rights for a couple of hundred pounds, while others
>want 10,000 up front and 25% royalties.  (Both extremes being
>madness in my opinion.)  The 'going rate' seems to be
>Gross Royalties of about 10-18% and an 'upfront' royalty payment
>of 100 - 500 pounds.  ANybody asking for upfront payments
>that are *not* royalties (it does happen) doesn't get anywhere with
>me, but I've heard it does happen.
>

Thanks for sharing that - it's always interesting to know a little of what
goes on behind the scenes...

>
>>>Presumably even a no-longer-running game would be outside the budget of a
>"fan" who simply wanted to see the game continue running?  (Feel free to tell
>me to mind my own business here - the topic's just tweaked my curiousity
>a little)<<
>
>
>Older games can often be picked up outright for a few hundred.
>Licenses can be cool too, but there are fewer new games out there
>and I've never yet seenone with a GM front end that wasn't
>a bit of a nightmare.  You've gotta be careful.
>

Licensing would, from what you've said, be a little hard for someone planning
to run it for free! (18% of nothing is, erm, nothing *grin*)

Regards,
Tim.

References

Re: It's about time!
tim@leaphome.pelican.org (Tim Franklin)
Sun, 07 Mar 1999 00:00:00 +0000
Re: It's about time!
madcentral@aol.com (MadCentral)
Mon, 08 Mar 1999 00:00:00 +0000