Re: 2 easy ways to win Spiral Arm!

From: havok@st1.vuw.ac.nz

Date: Sun, 15 Sep 1991 23:57:51 +0000

In article <1991Sep12.232330.5661@claven.cambridge.ibm.com>, owens@claven.cambridge.ibm.com (David Owens) writes:
> In article <1991Sep11.160856.1@st1.vuw.ac.nz> havok@st1.vuw.ac.nz writes:
>>In article <1991Sep9.172801.1@st1.vuw.ac.nz>, havok@st1.vuw.ac.nz writes:

Hi there folks, this is Protector (not a split personality) again, I'd like to
try to explain some things that have caused confusion a bit more clearly.

>>> There are two very easy very simple ways to win spiral arm.
>>> Number 1.  Build lots of UK, convince your neighbours not to attack you and sit
>>> on your bum for 20+ turns.  Watch those UKs!  Buy tech 25 or higher and roll
>>> everyone else, you will decimate them.  I know this works, I am doing this in
>>> one of my current games and all of the twelve people I am fighting are losing
>>> industry whereas my control percentage goes up by approx 1.5% per turn.
>>> This is commonly known as UK building and the enormous increases in UK really
>>> only happen in the last 4 turns.
>>
>>> Method 2.  Kill lots of UK builders.
>>
>> What a good idea! A weak player eg no Fleet, who I can kill in two turns or so.
>
> A weak player with no fleet... but hoards of cash that can quickly turn into
> fleet at the first sign of attack...

This is simply not true.  It takes about eight turns to get enough UK to break
even.  This is eight turns of uninterrupted 20% gains.  If you consider that it
takes about four turns to fill up all the empty space, and another four turns to
completely 'settle' the border (my last border violation was on turn four so
don't tell me it doesn't happen).  So on turn sixteen you break even.. hmm...
and you want to attack people on turn 20?  Also you can only convert about
1000UK into ships on a planet, if someone attacks you they will probably be next
to a colony, if they continue you build 1000K of spanking new ships for them,
with gains like that who cares about pop fire?  Your money is not an advantage
if you plough it into ships because ships do not directly contribute to the
economy (yes Havok, I know you can capture other peoples industry but that is
not the point).  As an example, lets say that you UK build and turn the lot into
ships, this may give you more fleet than anyone else, but I have seen people go
from having the largest fleet to "whats a dreadnought?" in nothing flat.  You
would do much better to put the money into something that can't be wiped out in
one turn, like tech or breeder colonies.

> This is the real reason I lean
> towards a UK builder (though a slight compromise - I don't stay that way
> as long as some.)

Frankly I would rather wait another eight to ten turns and get tech 25 and be
unstoppable.

> If you start as a UK builder and someone attacks you -
> you can switch strategies.  Just use all that money to build fleet (don't
> build UK to the exclussion of IND).

It is a lot easier to build the fleet at the start (just in case) and then, once
you know you are safe to build the UK.  If you build 180UK and the next turn you
are attacked you have effectively lost a DRD before the battle even begins.

> On the other hand if you start fighting
> people right from turn 1... you are committed.

Not even Havok attacks people from the word go.  A couple of turns is spent
weighing up the opposition and finding allies.  Then you ally with someone and
wipe out the mutant scum from (select one) Auckland/Palmerston North/Australia/
Dunedin/Across the street.  The key point is that you and your ally cooperate to
attack someone, you combine fleets and HSM locations.  This way you can wipe out
a player with no friends before turn ten, and afford it, and enjoy it!  You can
get about a 30% boost in economy and you are well on your way to being more
feared than being trapped into a conversation with the one who must be avoided.

> And if you can't guarrantee
> taking someone completely out... you both will grind up tons of fleet with
> little to show for it.  And if he's using your strategy too (the most common
> strategy) why should you win and not him?

This is true, but only if you attack him one on one, with an ally you can turn
him into sushi.

> The only way I would ever try fighting early in the game is if I had two
> or more allies and someone on my borders had none... AND all my allies
> agreed to throw everything at this person to completely wipe him out
> quickly.  Long drawn out battles are not worth fighting 99% of the time.
> Fair fights should be avoided at all costs.

A fair fight is a very bad thing.  Attacking with three allies doesn't seem to
work as well.  But then maybe your games aren't as cutthroat as ours are.

> Obviously both strategies work under some circumstances...  My recommendation
> is a compromise leanning towards UK building. (but ready to defend yourself
> if FORCED)... Build UK and develop your initial planets then swallow someone,
> build UK and fully-develop your new planets then swallow someone...  repeat
> as often as desired...

This is too slow, and if two big players gang up on you they will wipe the floor
with you.  The only way to be completely safe is to make more income than all
your neighbours, and your neighbours neighbours, and your neighbours neighbours
neighbours..... (This is not quite impossible, if you have more stars and more
ind than anyone else, and more special abilities than everyone else you are well
on the way).  If you get big through expansion this will make you safe from the
weenie players who have said nothing, done nothing and are nothing.  A couple
of big players who know what they are doing can allways beat a rabble of weenies

> Maybe someday we can all get in on the same game and put our strategies to
> the test together...

Your ideas have merit, but they just won't work in the aggressive New Zealand
games (I know, I have tried what you have described) for us UK building is very
much an all or nothing proposition.

Protector - Wait a while, it gets worse.

References

2 easy ways to win Spiral Arm!
havok@st1.vuw.ac.nz
Mon, 09 Sep 1991 05:28:01 +0000
Re: 2 easy ways to win Spiral Arm!
havok@st1.vuw.ac.nz
Wed, 11 Sep 1991 04:08:56 +0000
Re: 2 easy ways to win Spiral Arm!
owens@claven.cambridge.ibm.com (David Owens)
Thu, 12 Sep 1991 23:23:30 +0000