Re: PBM design: give away the formulas? (*FORMULAE !)

From: gl8f@fermi.clas.Virginia.EDU (Greg Lindahl)

Date: Mon, 21 Jun 1993 02:29:51 +0000

In article <1993Jun21.120033.1775@ccc.govt.nz> rob@ccc.govt.nz (Rob McNeur) writes:

>In real life, there is always a 'trial and error' learning curve on almost
>anything. I prefer the same sort of thing in PB(e)Ms.

So would I. But past history has taught me that I've played lots of
games where I see people getting wiped out (and quitting in disgust)
because of the learning curve. This is not good game design. A perfect
design where the results were intuitive and you didn't _need_ to know
those formulae would be best, but I've never met such a design.

For example, the commercial game "State of War" has a comment in the
rules that moving through mountain hexes causes you to lose troops.
It's only when you try it that you discover that the loss is so large
that you can wipe out an entire army in one turn. I'd hazard to guess
that nobody who's ever played State of War enjoyed discovering that
little rule.

>>    Show the formulas:
>>
>> 	o  Old-timers will know the formulas anyway, so not giving
>> 	   them to new players put them at a disadvantage.
>>
>Oldtimers may have a fairly good idea, learned by hard-won experience.
>But even oldtimers should never be able to work out the formulae exactly,
>merely to a best approximation from the final results.

That depends on what game we are talking about. And so does the answer
"reveal or not reveal".

Imagine playing Galaxy without knowing the formulae. I'd bet that an
experienced player would have a pretty good idea of what they were,
and would be able to beat the crap out of a newbie.

Now imagine playing a game where you need to make decisions at the
start about your position. A repeat player gains a huge advantage, and
someone who makes bad choices is going to just drop out. Add this to a
system where dropouts are a windfall to the neighbors... I've played
games like this. Never again.

I think we'd be in agreement on what the optimal realistic game would
be like, Rob and I. But I have some pretty strong views about what
would have worked better in the actual games I've played. And that's
why I publicize things in the games I play now. Just look at the
result: I make lots of friends who give me lots more information,
because they like what I do. I'm not that nice of a person
otherwise...

References

PBM design: give away the formulas?
skrenta@rt.com (Rich Skrenta)
Sat, 19 Jun 1993 18:12:59 +0000
Re: PBM design: give away the formulas? (*FORMULAE !)
rob@ccc.govt.nz (Rob McNeur)
Mon, 21 Jun 1993 12:00:33 +0000

Referenced By

PBM design: give away the formulas?
skrenta@rt.com (Rich Skrenta)
Sat, 19 Jun 1993 18:12:59 +0000
Re: PBM design: give away the formulas? (*FORMULAE !)
rob@ccc.govt.nz (Rob McNeur)
Mon, 21 Jun 1993 12:00:33 +0000