Re: Ongoing Strategy Games.

From: wbruvold@weber.ucsd.edu (William Bruvold)

Date: Fri, 09 Jul 1993 15:56:52 +0000

>In article <1993Jul9.000140.15601@cs.tcd.ie>, rwallace@cs.tcd.ie (Russell Wallace) writes:
>|> A better solution is to say, newbies are not expected to go up against
>|> established players (though they might against other newbies).  The way
>|> I implement this in Atlantis is to start new players in different
>|> regions, so by the time a large empire's advance scouts reach them,
>|> they'll be able to defend themselves.

THat would only be the case (getting tired of saying this) if there
was
a) A diseconomy of scale build into the rule making it difficult to
exert force that far away from your homeland.
b) No "natural" limit on learning and advantage curve, as currently
there is regarding bow (no reason to train past 2 in xbow/ 4 in
longbow)

While projecting force is a tedious proposition, (a lot less fun
than playing civ. solitaire imho) it isn't so hard that you are at a
disadvantage when you arrive at your location.  (the area with the
newbie sheep).

Starting new players in new areas is like starting in say an "open"
(everyone starts with one territory 5 armies) risk game 3 turns
late.  By that time you might be able to build up a position before
your opponents get there but they have an advantage (because of the
size they have built up) when they decide to destroy you.

NON atlantean hit "n" now....

Lets look through the rules and realize why some of us who will die
in a couple of turns are droping out in the immediate future and
will not be asking for a restrart in all likelyhood.....

1)  You can train while sailing.  Means that making that four month
journey across the sea isn't costly except for the "captain" of the
ship.  You can, of course, train while waiting for the ship to be
built
2)  "tax" takes no time.  Allows players to "tax" and move (or
study)
A big
advantage and no constraint on power projection across the map
3)  The 20:1 ratio between tax and support needs.  Means that for an
army of say 600 grunts you need only 30 armed men.  The buildup of
funds in plains squares make it almost certain that your army can be
fed along its march.
4)  The high learning curve for advantage in magic and bows and low
curve for swords.  Yes, my pet game balance problem as it gives a
"trump" to those factions which got to that resource first.

And one last one that has come to light by participating in a
straightforward war game (star empires).   By putting newbies in the
same area and making email addresses public you "encouraged" people
who had played in Oly and elsewhere to ally with one another OR to
send in multiple accounts to play numberous factions.

How atlantis might be saved.

Russel, you need to admit that this game is NOT a rpg.  It isn't
because there isn't anything to role play about.  Oh sure, you can
set up a illicit establishment like the player did and post
announcement to the times but visiting said house did nothing to
change game play so it was cute but nothing one could not have found
on countless muds.  Without uniques things to do (other than kill
others) it is a slow "conquer the world game" with a bit of "magic"
(a skill hard to get) and neat names of provinces.  If you wanted it
to have a RPG the most straightforward method is by having NPC who
can add excitement (read goals) to the game.  Make an evil lord,
perhaps commanded by you or a dummy program) reside to the north of
Wallace iseland and thus encourage cooper/coordination between the
players.  Have a sword to be found of great power and the questers
immune from attack.  Special squares, Portals to different places on
the map.  etc.

THE OTHER WAY is to reroll but this time set up however many maps
you need and then let players start off _APART_ from each other.
This would allow players to build up before they encountered others
and would encourage more interesting diplomacy, intrigue, and
excitment.

ERik

References

Re: Ongoing Strategy Games.
cedman@golem.ps.uci.edu (Carl Edman)
Thu, 08 Jul 1993 22:46:51 +0000
Re: Ongoing Strategy Games.
rwallace@cs.tcd.ie (Russell Wallace)
Fri, 09 Jul 1993 00:01:40 +0000
Re: Ongoing Strategy Games.
js138@cus.cam.ac.uk (John Sloan)
Fri, 09 Jul 1993 04:33:12 +0000

Referenced By

Re: Ongoing Strategy Games.
cedman@golem.ps.uci.edu (Carl Edman)
Thu, 08 Jul 1993 22:46:51 +0000
Re: Ongoing Strategy Games.
rwallace@cs.tcd.ie (Russell Wallace)
Fri, 09 Jul 1993 00:01:40 +0000
Re: Ongoing Strategy Games.
js138@cus.cam.ac.uk (John Sloan)
Fri, 09 Jul 1993 04:33:12 +0000