Vga-planets FAQ (for Survey) From: ktmiller@midway.ecn.uoknor.edu (Khanh T Miller) Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1993 00:59:25 +0000 Here is a posting of the FAQ. Perhaps this will help with the survey. So far over 80% are for keeping the annoucements, with comments ranging from: I don't play it, but it belongs here (pbm) It is the only way I could find out about the game It is a waste of bandwidth and doesn't belong here etc... ------------------------------------- *VGA Planets - FAQ - version 1993 11 15* * Part 1 (of 3) * FAQ written by Roger Burton-West <ubte30e@ccs.bbk.ac.uk>. Thanks to everybody who has contributed . . . and thanks especially to Tim Wisseman, the author of VGA Planets! Continued by Gary Grothman <grothmag@vax.cs.hscsyr.edu>. This is the FAQ for alt.games.vga-planets. Each section begins with "Subject:"; pressing ^G in some newsreaders (trn) will advance to the next section. Players (especially novices) may also want to take a bo-peep at the "HINTS: periodic strategy posting" which also appears about weekly on alt.games.vga-planets. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Administrivia Input is invited, send mail to grothmag@vax.cs.hscsyr.edu Particularly welcome are: Information on actual Order of Battle Formulae concerning population maxima, or simple "rules of thumb" Information on available third-party utilities/extras Please tell me if you think something should be added, removed, or if you have any corrections. I'm not a wizard, I just maintain this FAQ. I rely largely on others to keep it relevant, current, & correct. Changes since version of 1993-10-19: Corrected typo in related games & newsgroups (thanks Mark Manville) Updated "What is the latest version?" "Where can I get a copy?": added Tim Continuum BBS "Where can I get a copy?": added new Colorado site Added new question re: transferring special missions with captures Modified "What are the rules for Fed planet mining?" (thanks Jeremiah Overton) Bumped several questions down the "parts" series. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Questions in this FAQ: PART 1: What is VGA Planets? Who is the author? What hardware do I need? Where can I get a copy? Why should I register? What is the latest version? What is this group for? What if someone just begs to be flamed? How long do games typically last? What happens if I am out of town and miss a turn? PART 2: What about cheating? So how do I run a game over the Net? What about similar games and related newsgroups? (Specific game-play questions follow:) I have tech 6, but xxx doesn't show up on the build hull screen. Why? What are the rules for Federation planet mining? Why didn't my planet capture that attacking ship? Why did the colonists I dropped on a new planet vanish? How do I transfer fighters/torps between ships? Why doesn't that ship conform to spec? What is the order of movement/combat/actions in a turn? What is the real Order of Battle? PART 3: In what order do Privateers Rob ships? Is there a way to save old messages? Where can I get sheet.exe? What is the maximum population allowed on a world? What happens when 500 ships have been built? I've captured a <race x> ship, can I now [Rob, Pillage, Cloak]?" !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What is VGA Planets? VGA Planets is a graphical multi-player play by mail strategy game, which simulates conflict in space between galactic empires. The game emphasizes mining, colonization and the construction of starships. The players compete against each other on a galactic scale. Although there is an economic component to the game, it is mainly a tactical and strategic wargame. Although the player with the best economy usually has the best potential to win, it's not the purpose of the game - and the scoring system reflects this. The game system allows players to construct their own starships by selecting various components and placing them on a given hull type. The game can be played on one computer alone, but it was really designed to be a BBS or net game. The game can be played on any BBS that supports file transfers, with or without the sysop's help. Many people are playing VGA Planets over the Net using Email and UUENCODE. Players upload their turn (.TRN) files to the host BBS or Email account. The host runs the actual calculations involved, and produces result (.RST) files which are sent back to the players. The players run the local program to view their situation and set up their orders for the next turn. The game can be compared to a 11 player chess game in which all players move all their pieces simultaneously, one turn at a time. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Who is the author? Tim Wisseman PO Box 204 North Fork CA 93643-204 cocomax@gorn.echo.com +1 209 877-2320 (Saturday 9 am to 8 pm, Sunday 4 pm to 8 pm PST) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What hardware do I need? The game can be played on any IBM compatible PC with VGA and a hard drive. The standard version runs on 286 and faster machines. The Host program doesn't need a graphics card, only a hard drive and a 286 or faster machine. There is also a version available for the PC-XT, but this must be obtained directly from the author. The author is reportedly working on a Unix host program, but this is a low priority. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Where can I get a copy? You can get the shareware version of VGA Planets by anonymous FTP from: site: ftp.ucsc.edu [128.114.2.10] dir: /PC/vgaplanets-2.2 or: /PC/vgaplanets-3.0 Get all the files (remember, binary mode!) and run INSTALL. The latest host update may be available in the above directory. Also take a look in /incoming at the same site. The REGISTERED version of VGA Planets is available directly from the author (see Subject: Who is the author?). In Europe, the distributor is Henrik Moerk: Lene@vax.psl.ku.dk AKA: Hmk@research.novo.dk FIDO: 2:231/306 The documentation for the unregistered game includes information on how and why to register. Europeans may wish to check out: ftp.fu-berlin.de, directory: /pub/pc/games/vgaplanets/vp-3.0-install for the game package, .../ps-files for postscript files, .../maptool for map utilities, and .../util for the latest files & also most of the useful utilities that you may hear about on this list. North Americans (& others) can also access this site, of course, but try to use a closer site (ftp.ucsc.edu or the new one, see below, from North America. If you're from New Zealand, your choice 8-) . New U.S. ftp site: risc11.cahs.colostate.edu (129.82.159.19) directory: /pub/planets .../planet30 for the unregistered package .../hosts for upgrades & utilities, etc. Problems with this site should be mailed to: Brian Convery: convery@osprey.cahs.colostate.edu File contributions should be "put" to: /pub/incoming & you should also inform Brian so he can move the files to the appropriate directory. Finally, there is the Tim Continuum BBS: (209)877-4921 I haven't called myself, but I imagine you can reach the Tim there, as well as getting various utilities & the latest host updates. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Why should I register? #include <shareware.ethics.h> Apart from that, consider that: (1) In v2.2, only registered players can attain tech levels 7-10. (2) In v3.0, all players can attain the high tech levels, but it's rather more work. (3) If Tim doesn't get any money, he doesn't have a lot of incentive to develop the game any further! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What is the latest version? The current version of VGA Planets is v3.0. v3.0 offers many additional features over v2.2, the last major upgrade. However, v2.2 is still widely in use, and is likely to remain so for some time. Newer host versions have been released, the latest being v3.13a. The more recent releases allow the host (only) to modify many game parameters, including race special abilities, minefield size maxima & decay rates, cloaking efficiency, and many others. Version 3.13b is reportedly imminent. These new releases are only necessary for the person hosting the game; players need only version 3.0. However, players should examine the documentation of the release being used by their host, as many of the changes have a huge influence on game play. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What is this group for? This group serves two purposes: (1) It is a contact point for prospective players and hosts. (2) It is a discussion forum for the game, tricks and tips, and suggestions for future versions. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What if someone begs to be flamed? GROUP BAITING: Every once in a blue moon, some extremely "clever" individual will decide to have a little fun by baiting the readers of a newsgroup. The general theme and content of these posts are fairly predictable; typically, they assert the newsgroup readers: are nerds, geeks, and/ or weenies, etc., have obviously never kissed a girl, and also, presumably, covet the "irrefutedly" successful romantic lifestyle of the group's detractor. Posts, such as these, will show up at various game oriented newsgroups, the Trek groups, and possibly others as well. One likely motivation of these posters is precisely to generate a slew of responses, although they may not even read the newsgroup again. Also, sometimes inflammatory prank posts are written when an account is left unattended. Readers should quench their understandable urge to refute unfounded accusations; responses are wasted bandwidth, especially since they probably only encourage these diatribes. [Peter M. White, pmwg1641@edu.uiuc.cso.uxa] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: How long do games typically last? Generally at least 50 turns. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What happens if I am out of town and miss a turn? The game will continue normally. Your ships and bases will continue performing their last order. Ships will continue on the same course and speed, and planets will continue to mine minerals and produce supplies. A missed turn /can't/ be made up! And make sure, when you submit the next turn, that it's based on the most recent available .RST file - if you make a .TRN based on an old .RST, it will be ignored. *VGA Planets - FAQ - version 1993 11 15* * Part 2 (of 3) * !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Questions in this segment of the FAQ: What about cheating? So how do I run a game over the Net? What about similar games and related newsgroups? (Specific game-play questions follow:) I have tech 6, but xxx doesn't show up on the build hull screen. Why? What are the rules for Federation planet mining? Why didn't my planet capture that attacking ship? Why did the colonists I dropped on a new planet vanish? How do I transfer fighters/torps between ships? Why doesn't that ship conform to spec? What is the order of movement/combat/actions in a turn? What is the real Order of Battle? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What about cheating? Well, it happens. v2.2 was notorious for being fairly easy to hack around, and there has been some fairly acrimonious discussion in this group about what to do with those who cheat, and how it might be prevented. In essence, there's no /quick/ way to catch a cheater; but not many people are foolish enough to try it. Let me reiterate: it's EASY to hack v2.2! It doesn't show that you're clever, and it's not particularly impressive. If you suspect a fellow player of cheating, probably the best course of action is to send a message to the host, setting out what you suspect has gone wrong. Be reasoned! Tim has produced a program called CHKSHIPS (distributed with the game) which tests for overloaded ships (too much fuel, cargo or equipment). A related problem is accidental use of high-tech equipment - if a player is in several games, it can be hard to remember which ones are unregistered. Torben Thellefsen Nielsen <monty@iesd.auk.dk> produced a program for v2.2 called UBI, which scans for tech levels greater than 6 in an unregistered game. A specific area of concern regards player passwords. The passwords are trivially easy to discover from an .RST file, and with this knowledge one could download someone's turn from a BBS, give inappropriate orders, and upload them. Although this is not such a problem over the Net, the danger still exists. My own preferred solution is to ignore game passwords completely, and to use an encryption package such as PGP (Pretty Good Privacy), which is available for downloading from (among others) wuarchive.wustl.edu [128.252.135.4] and garbo.uwasa.fi [128.214.87.1]. This package serves four purposes: it creates a validating signature so that the recipient can be sure the file has come from the right person, it encrypts the file so that only the intended recipient can read it, it compresses the file, and it converts it to a uuencode- like format for mailing. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: So how do I run a game over the Net? Post an announcement to alt.games.vga-planets, with a subject such as "players wanted". In the post, try to cover the following points. (Typical answers are shown in square brackets.) * Which version of the game will be used? [v2.2, v3.0 or later, give host version; Shareware or Registered] * When will the game be starting (i.e. first .RST files get sent out)? * How often will turns be run? [Once per day; Mondays, Wednesdays, Fridays] * When are the turn deadlines, and when will turns be sent out? Given the international nature of this newsgroup, try to give a GMT time as well as your local zone. * Will you be playing in the game? Some players don't like the host to play, so it's only fair to warn them off. * What setup parameters are used? v3.x especially has a very large array of options, so be clear on the sort of game you'll be running. * What skill level will the game be? (In practice, what sort of player are you looking for? Novice, intermediate, expert?) * Are alliance negotiations by Email allowed? [Usually, yes] * Are player passwords in use? [Normally not, over Email] * How should players choose races? ["State first three choices" seems to work well.] * Are non-standard race names usable? [Up to you as host] * What is the ending condition for the game? [First to reach a specified number of points; highest score on specified date; last player left alive, specific objectives...] * What subject line should Emailed turns carry? (Useful if you can extract files automatically.) * Where should the turns go, and where should queries go? [The account from which the message is posted] * Any other information. Remind players that they will need a uuencode and uudecode package. (You could use something unusual, like PGP radix-64 or xxencode, but it's probably not worth it for most purposes.) Leave at least a few days for responses to come in, and make sure you have connectivity to each player's site before starting the game! After that, it's just a matter of capturing the turns, uudecoding, running the Host, uuencoding the results and mailing them out. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What about similar games and related newsgroups? The newsgroup rec.games.pbm has postings about play-by-email games, many of which have a space theme but don't have fancy graphical front-ends. You can obtain the FAQ for that newsgroup via anonymous ftp from ftp.erg.sri.com. The newsgroup comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.strategic occasionally carries material on VGA Planets. (questions related to game-play follow) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: I have Tech 6 but don't see a Large Freighter on the "hulls available" list. Why?! You don't have the resources to build it; when you do, it will show up on the list. [Ryan Grant <rmg53668@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu>] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What are the rules for Federation mining of planets? Feds mine 1/2 (normal with reptilian natives) and always get 25 KT of each remaining mineral with >= 100 mines, no matter how scattered the minerals are. This last is undocumented; it makes it useless for the Fed to build mines on homeworld, unless you can get to about 250-300. It does make them the best miners for badly scattered planets, however. [Andrew Jones (lrpr@unb.ca)] The new hconfig [3.11d is the latest host at the time of writing... Gary] default lists the federation mining rate at 70% not 50% although I do believe they still get the 25kt bonus. [Jon Hathaway (Hathaway@xray.byu.edu)] The minimum 10kt no longer seems to apply, at least for host 3.12. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Why didn't my planet capture that attacking ship? ...it had no crew but was still fighting my planet! Tim is aware of this - his reply to a similar message: I know about this bug and there is nothing that can be done about it short of replacing the VCR program that everyone is using and doing so would be a nightmare. So we will just make it a rule instead of a bug. Ships with no crew will continue to fire at planets. The targeting computer is locked onto the planet. The planet is such an easy target that the targeting computer can continue to fire even after the crew is all dead. [Scott@Hades.equinox.gen.nz (Scott McNabb)] [Note: I have seen a case where a planet captured a ship...the crew were killed, but the battle was timed-out before either the ship or the planet could be destroyed. At this point the VCR declared the ship captured...Gary] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Why did the colonists I dropped on a new planet vanish? Amorphous planet, perhaps? [Scott@Hades.equinox.gen.nz (Scott McNabb)] Anther possibility: the "planet" was still in revolution from a previous owner [Gary] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: How do I transfer fighters/torps between ships? I really hate to say this but "I've heard" (there, I did it) that on the transfer screen, you can use 7 to transfer fighters, even though it only shows options 1-6. [Scott@Hades.equinox.gen.nz (Scott McNabb)] Torpedoes: the solution is not so simple. You can have one ship lay a minefield, then use the special friendly code included with your registered game to "scoop" up the minefield with another ship. This works regardless of the torpedo type. Transfer between races also works like this...[Gary] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Why doesn't that ship conform to spec? Example: In the manual, the D7a Painmaker Class Cruiser is listed as cloaking-capable. ...It's the D7 Coldpain Cruiser that cloaks not the Painmaker. [mrh0631@Zeus.tamu.edu (Mark Hesidence)] The manual has several errors of this sort, as Tim is too busy changing the actual game to spend much time changing the manuals... A comprehensive list of these discrepancies is being worked on by mdl@world.std.com (Michael D Lemon). I'm sure he would appreciate any additions people could send to him. In the meantime, rely on the ship stats reported by the game (in the build screens), not the documentation. Also, certain utility programs like ships.exe, vputil.exe, and others will report the actual capabilities... !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What is the order of movement/combat/actions in a turn? Special missions (Super Refit, "Hssss"ing, Spying, Plundering, Robbing, Cyborg repair, Dark sense, presumably building fighters in space (?)). Most other missions occur next. This includes minelaying, beaming up or down, minesweeping. Note that minesweeping (and generation of minefield reports) occurs after minelaying & mergeing, if applicable. Next comes movement. Last come scans, exploration & combat. The above is just pulled from memory. I would appreciate if anyone would send me a more detailed breakdown of the above. Or I could do it myself, eventually... [Gary] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What is the real Order of Battle? The OOB in the docs is bogus; until the version 3.1 host, with the numeric friendly code determining OOB, the lowest ID fights first. Period. Except, I believe, that freighters will fight last. [Andrew Jones (lrpr@unb.ca)] 1. Games versions 3.0x and 3.1x are both buggy for OOB. 2. Their docs are bogus for OOB. 3. The emendations proferred here are bogus too. 4. Everyone should do thorough simulations of multi-ship combats. - It is not true that lowest ID combat ships always fight first in versions 3.0x; the real OOB is not simple, but it is not documented anywhere. [Lower ID ships very often do fight first; but this depends on other factors which are not correctly documented.] - SIMULATE before you commit your ships to combat. [harwood@umiacs.umd.edu (David Harwood)] *VGA Planets - FAQ - version 1993 11 15* * Part 3 (of 3) * !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Questions in this segment of the FAQ: In what order do Privateers Rob ships? Is there a way to save old messages? Where can I get sheet.exe? What is the maximum population allowed on a world? What happens when 500 ships have been built? I've captured a <race x> ship, can I now [Rob,Pillage,Cloak...]? !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: In what order do Privateers Rob ships? When a Privateer ship is set to "rob ship" and there is more than one enemy ship present, it robs the ship with the lowest ID number first. The Privateer ship will remove all fuel first. If the Privateer still has space in its tanks, it will suck more fuel from the next highest ID, and so on. Cargo is robbed independently of fuel, since cargo space is independent of the fuel tank. Again, the Privateer ship will rob from the lowest ID ship first. It will steal Moly first, then Tritanium, then duranium, and I can't recall if colonists or supplies are next. Once the first ship is completely drained of cargo, if the Privateer has space left, it will move on to the next highest ID and begin again (Moly, Trit, etc.) Privateers cannot steal fighters (even if robbing with a carrier) or torpedoes. [Eric Pawtowski, epawtows@polaris.async.vt.edu or epawtows@vt.edu] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: Is there a way to save old messages? Yes, the newer versions of the SHEET.EXE utility let you save messages to a file or printer. I's available on Tim's BBS, I don't know about the FTP sites. [Daniel@polaris.async.vt.edu (Daniel Pawtowski)] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: where can I get sheet.exe? Sheet.exe is not available by ftp, since this is a bonus program for people who register. Either get it from the Tim Continuum BBS or just register to get it. I think Tim will get you the latest release on your disk. [lumpi@dobag.in-berlin.de (Joern Lubkoll)] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What is the maximum population allowed on a world? For native races: For the new host [3.1+? ...Gary] there is a maximum population of 25 million. [Klein@badlands.NoDak.edu (Michael P Klein)] [I would love to hear the formula for maximum colonist population by world type...Gary] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ~Subject: What happens when 500 ships have been built? VGA Planets has a built-in limit of 500 ships allowed at one time. Once 500 ships exist, further ship build orders at starbases are not performed until new "slots" have been freed up (by colonize missions, recycling, or battle). When slots are available, VGA Planets scans through the starbases by ID# (starting at 1, up to 500) for build missions, and performs them until the 500 ship limit is reached. ID# of a base is, of course, identical to the id# of the planet where the base is located. What this means in practice is that a base at planet #1 will always get first crack at filling any available ship slots, while a base at planet #500 will seldom if ever build ships once the limit has been reached. This limit is not reached in all games, but where it does, it can significantly alter strategy & the balance of power (see the HINTS document for comments). !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I've captured a <race x> ship, can I now [Rob,Pillage,Cloak...]? Capturing ships, with or without the owners' consent, is common in VGA Planets. However, not all "special features" will operate for the new owner. The basic rule of thumb is: if the feature is a property of the crew/race, it is not transferrable. If the property is a feature of the ship, it is transferrable. See the lists below: Transferrable: Cloaking Gravitonic Accelerators (& associated 1/2 fuel consumption) Not Transferrable: Super Refit Hissss Take 150% Damage before spewing pixels across the screen Super Spy Pillage Rob 3x "kill" damage with beams Repair Damage mission Web Mines Dark Sense Build Fighters (as mission or Rebel innate ability) Sweep mines with fighters END FAQ---------------------------- -- Khanh Miller ktmiller@constellation.ecn.uoknor.edu - Up