Quest Digest, 3/12/94 From: ">>-Josh->" <J.P.Gallagher@durham.ac.uk> Date: Sun, 04 Dec 1994 18:37:35 +0000 On the suggestion of a couple of people, I am posting the Quest digest to this news group. The Digest is a compilation of discussion points from people included on the Quest mailing list I am maintaining. The Digest is written essentially for the mailing list, and posting here is a test to see how well it will go down. It is very much styled towards e-mailing a set number of people than appearing on a newsgroup, so please excuse the style. Well, enough of the disclaiming, here it is... >>-Josh-> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- JPG> Hi all! New people too! Hope you had a pleasant couple of days pondering over the official alliances since I last wrote. I did mean to post earlier, but as my e-mail server was down for a few hours, I couldn't. JPG> Right, usual intro stuff (newbies mainly); if you don't want this lovely mail, just write to me and ask to be taken off the list. I don't want to be the cause of nuisance mail. If you have stuff you'd like to add, please send it to me and I will include it in the next Digest. JPG> Okay, that being over with, let me begin. First, Rogerio Fung, ammending his change world spell... ----------------------> RF> well, didnt really mean to have change worlds spell to all who wanted..of course it would require a high skill mage, let's say...90+, each world would have a different spell code, so anyone travelling to a specific world would have to find the code to that world....plus, the spell would require other objects, and it would exhaust ALL members 'mana' an not only the mage's...-so what do you say? by the way, I dont mind waiting for the Santa Claus, I'm no where near the power required to make it... <----------------------- JPG> Santa Claus could give you presents if you have had a good allignment for the whole year! *I* would qualify! :) JPG> Nik Olver on the subject of his name (I only ever saw the np-olver version). I know it is not strictly in subject, but hey! And anyway, it's got some interesting Game 6 alliance news... (Difficult to know where to put your initials here Nik!) ------------------------> NPO> It's funny you should meintion my name josh because (add your choice of swear words to this!) _KJC_ ( Well, not really :) have for the past few turns changed my name from nik to nitz, in my alliance adverts..... ( My writting, I suppose :), and i'm sure I wrote it clearly last time. The thing is thou, I have had a few inquirys about the alliance, since KJC did this, amazing cos I thought every one in game 6 is a lemming and joins the THE EIGHT GODS -- ( Stefans Alliance ) ("it's so big, hes got a leak problem like the titanic!") ( This I quote from the mouth of the Shadow Cabinet -- the other up and coming, new alliance in game 6. The leader is Ed Wilson. Hes got a very sharp wit and he insists on poking people with it! ) My main gripe thou, is that my sister ( oh, you can definately add your favourite swear words to that. ) thinks snail mail addressed to Nitz Olver is VERY funny. Sign of her personality, I tell myself. <------------------------ JPG> Chris Clarke has replied to virtually every point on the last list, so here it all is; <G> ------------------------> > FM> No, but if I walked into 5 rooms and in 3 rooms I have to investigate 6-8 > objects, it needs 2 turns to see all things! (And to find lost of gold!) :-) > <---------------------- > JPG> I do still think it is excessive. Does anyone else agree that this > doesn't make for interesting turns? CC> Lots on I orders containing "It was empty" "We couldn't get it open" are boring but way around it is to do just a few of them - be selective. The *real* pain is when you do a turn full of I orders and they all fail because you didn't cross-reference you room/item number sheet correctly and you were in the wrong room. (I never said I was bright!) CC> I actually map the dugeon level (using the spell) then go through each room to get a list of every item in all of the rooms first (only doing I orders when I run out of movement points). Then I work my way back doing I orders. CC> BTW Don't bother investigating level one if your party can handle level five - just go straight down using Jaunt (or the stairs if you DF's need the exercise!). <--------------------- JPG> Doesn't the above listing and returning method still take ages though? I am going to cut and splice a bit now and shove all the newsgroup bits together. Chris Clarke again first. ----------------------> > CC> Not everyone has access to *all* alt.* newsgroups. The groups have to be > requested - and there's no guarentee that the group with then be taken. > > JPG> I would certainly request it from the head of our news host. I'm CC> But he is entitled to refuse to take it. EVERYONE gets the rec.* newsgroups. > RF> Anyway, about newsgroups, I dontthink I have access to it, so, I would > vote against...FAQ about quest? CC> FAQ - frequently asked questions <Ewan Jones> EJ> I would personally like to see a newsgroup being set up just for quest and compatibales, however I think the pbm one that is already on will make make the admin inclined to say no, after all there is still the option of using the existing newsgroup. <Chris Dickson> CD> Mailing list idea: unless he posts the entire source code for Quest to the list, I think we should create a newsgroup just for Steven Fairbrother and post 2,000 articles a day to it. [Humungous grin] CD> rec.games.pbm charter; I'm not completely convinced. Although Chris C's first draft at a charter has got an awful lot going for it (nice job Chris! I presume posting to rec.food.drink.beer is the obligatory silly?) I think we should get the hardcore support first who would vote yes for r.g.p.q whatever form the charter took, rather than having a charter and proposing it for discussion. CD> We need to know just how many Quest-ers there are out there who... 1) have Internet access 2) have USENET access 3) would vote YES in a CFV. CD> The best way to do this is to bring it up as a "Message from KJC Games" at the bottom of Quest results sheets for about 3 weeks, much better than a note in KJC News or First Class (which less than half of players read anyhow) and similar ones in other Quest moderators' games. Also note that the Crasiworld Game is "Crasimoff's Quest World", not "Crasimoff's World" which is a hand-moderated role-playing type of thing, and probably very good too, but a completely different kettle of fish to our beloved Quest. I could be wrong on this... CD> Alternatively we could all just agree to post at least 5 messages to rec.games.pbm a day each, but I for one certainly feel much more comfortable posting to Josh, knowing 30 or so people will read it, rather than a newsgroup, where anywhere from 10 to 10,000,000 people will read it. I'm getting a bit fed up with rec.games.pbm anyway, it's been taken over by ARENA, which is a PBeM not a PBM even! <David Cragg> DC> Secondly, re a Quest specific newsgroup.... I would vote no to this. DC> Why? Well until I see numerous quest posts in the rec.games.pbm newsgroup, I see no reason to create a seperate newsgroup. You can hardly call r.g.p a heavy used newsgroup by any strech of the imagination! DC> If however you do go ahead with a new newsgroup idea, you will be forced to start the discussion after Chirstmas, so that all that may wish to be involved with the discussion can do so, i.e. mid January. <-------------------- JPG> Okay, despite my recent post to r.g.pbm I am beginning to wonder about the idea of the newsgroup. It would quickly be seen that there are not a whole load of posts on r.g.pbm to do with Quest. I think that maybe we don't have a 'critical mass' of Questers interested in talking on the net to sustain a newsgroup discussion. It appears that people feel far more inclined to talk by e-mail, despite the obvious advantages of a news group to talk in. Keep the opinions coming in. JPG> Maybe my cut and paste techniques aren't perfect, as I now have more stuff (from Chris C) on Change Worlds spell. -----------------------> CC> I don't think a change world spell would work. What's the point in having a maximum of three groups per game when you can then change worlds? Also as has already been mentioned - some games would be deserted. Although you'd have to weigh losing all of the information about a game against the fresh challenge - I wouldn't mind moving to a later KJC game where the spell reagents are cheaper! > JPG> Will you include Father Christmas in with the next batch of new > monsters Steve? :-> CC> How about a KJC-staff monster which hides in the pool room at pub meets?! Sorry. Very sorry. I like my groups the way they are. <grovel> <Chris Dickson> CD> Change World spell; I've always been in favour of a (one-way?) journey to a "harder" world, for tough parties, in effect a new game. <---------------------- JPG> I too am in favour of a high powered world, and so too was the Librarian (remember him folks?) when he was still playing. It would balance the games for a start. JPG> Okay, the rest from Chris C now... -----------------------> (re: should FAQ include spell lists?) CC> OK, I'm leaning towards making it a request-list, but I'd still like a few more opinions first. There's no point leaving it out of the FAQ if everyone who recieves the FAQ is then going to request a list! <----------------------- JPG> And the rest from Ewan Jones... -----------------------> EJ> (2) Official alliances - sounds very promising, any ideas when they will become a reality ? One thing I would say though is that it sounds far too expensive for most people, even experienced groups wouldn`t want to shell out 50 grand or so (especially since robbing is now harder than it`s ever been in the past) just for the privellige of running an official alliance, and what about those groups who don`t have good thieves, it would take much longer by doing tq`s. Still, it would expand peoples options and for those who have more money than sense it would provide more things to do beside seeing how many pc`s they can kill off. EJ> (3) What about any other changes, e.g horses and such? Are they going to happen or are they just an idea being thrown about? EJ> (4) I don`t remember who was asking about blurbs a couple of days back but I havea (near) complete set (thanks to Stefan) for the Amiga which I would be willing to send for inclussion in a faq or similar piece. (JPG> Blurb broadcasting is a no-no; they are copyright. Of course, if they were re-written in different words...) EJ> (5) Any groups in game 6 being dropped at the moment? If so, please contact me, I would like to talk to you. <--------------------- JPG> Game 6 and game 14 are sounding the most interesting at the moment. I think the official alliances will liven up all of them very shortly though, with a few alterations to the plan! :) JPG> Chris Dickson now... ----------------------> CD> The alliance rules look deeply sorted and should turn a very good game into a superb game. Particularly the long awaited new A/AA orders. At last there will be some LARGE money target for superior groups to attain, almost like the Mob Boss stage in It's A Crime!, which made the game so good. I agree with you about the kicking-out-traitors-for-nothing thing, though. Furthermore I leave college at the end of the term tomorrow so as like as not I won't have e-mail access for another six weeks or so. Let me be the first (almost!) to wish everybody on the list a very merry Christmas and a pleasant new year. <---------------------- JPG> This was the first of two good-byes he posted! Niall Davis now... ----------------------> ND> Alliance Info - Game 14 ND> Game 14 has been dominated for some time by an alliance known as the BKA (Black Knight Alliance) Having taken a city Crohn(14) some time back, they have started to expand. Till now they have been unchallanged in their practices which have generally been Evil. I.e. tactics such as attacks in cities and using high powered Mages with flee factors of 0% so that any group comming close gets well and trully trounced before they have a chance to hit back. Lately however the growing animity born towards the BKA has manifested itself in the Pheonix alliance. The Phoenix have for some time been publishing threats in the city's news sheets and in the game 14 news sheet and the BKA have been responding. The next weeks and or months should tell just how it develops but there seems to be a battle par excelence brewing at present. <---------------------- JPG> As I say, interesting in Game 14. Chris Dickson wrote again last night with the following detailed thoughts on the official alliances. ----------------------> CD> "Alliance is a group of 5 or more similarly inclined parties" - define similarly inclined, please. Mutual defence is enough of a common goal for me, I don't fancy a RESTRICTION of a common religious goal. CD> "Alliance falls apart if less than 5 active members" - define active. If this means 3 weeks in a row have less than 5 alliance members submitting turns then that's OK, but perhaps an alliance might be able to go "on holiday" in the same manner that a party can, if the alliance leaders know they're going to be hit badly by missed turns? CD> All alliance members must meet in one city to form the alliance; could a town not suffice? (JPG> Towns don't generally have missing shops unless I am mistaken.) CD> Alliances can be robbed and have funds stolen; hopefully not a lot, though, or a lot of alliances may go bankrupt and Novala will be made even stronger than she is at the moment. CD> How will the separation between alliance funds and alliance leaders' funds be made? CD> Wilderness HQs- yes! yes! yes! Great idea!!! But they should cost BIG TIME money - we're talking 6 figures of GPs here. That said it could lead into almost campaign-style interaction; if anyone is familiar with Companion set rules from the original Dungeons and Dragons, they will know how much fun leading a land-based campaign can be. Plenty of scope for development on this front, almost the "Quest for Power" option mooted in the original rules. (Who's still got their original original rulebook? I do!) JPG> I agree about the wilderness HQ, but not *that* much money! Why should they cost any more than twice the price of highly sought after land in cities? CD> 16-letter limit on alliance names? Don't like it, but if that's all there is space to print on the turn sheet then so be it. JPG> I don't like it at all! "The Confederation" is 17 letters! And the 'The' is an integral part! CD> Newspaper alliance adverts; perhaps you could put reminders on alliance leaders' print-outs, as the current guidelines are not followed. Perhaps alliances could get 1 rumour card per turn extra as well? CD> New alliance HQs cost 50,000 GP? Gulp. Although I approve of having BIG figures to aim at as there is little for mega-developed parties to do at the moment (hence all the inter-party combat) I think 50,000 for another HQ may be a tad much. JPG> Far too much. The hall of fame in our newsletter has the greatest gold total as 40,000 from the Shadowen. Nobody else, as far as I know, has come close. CD> AP order ; have read this a couple of times and I don't understand the difference between slots 1-8 and 11-18. Probably me being dense but I'd appreciate a clearer distinction. CD> List of things alliances could do; perhaps they could provide Minor Healing as a service. Perhaps things could be (set a proportion) cheaper for members than for non-members. Certainly it's very interesting to see the list of all possible items (weapons, armour etc.) but in a way I'd rather not have seen that list. At least I think it shouldn't be sent out to any more people. :-) The other amusing thing is item 125, short spear, item 126, spear! Does this mean that parties can buy spears after all... but only from alliance HQs? Funny laugh! <--------------------- JPG> It means that you know if somebody belongs to an alliance though! They start off by throwing spears at you! The following stuff is misc from Chris D... ---------------------> CD> Follow roads; anything you can program in that's better than it is now will be gratefully accepted Steven. Perhaps you could just improve the AI used in the L order so that if roads are available in the direction of desired travel then they are used. CD> Prophecy spell; whassatthen? Does it reveal what improvements KJC will be adding to the game next, and when they'll be implemented? <Big grin> Actually that's a cool idea for a spell anyway... JPG> This was one of Chris C's comments. I am curious too. In joke somewhere I suspect! CD> Right, that's all for now, and I'm off home from University tomorrow so I'll wish you all a bloomin' good 'un. <--------------------- JPG> Okay folks, that is everything I have been sent. Now for a final paragraph which I shall entitle "This that and the other" just cos I feel it needs a title. "This That and the Other" ======================= I am leaving for a holiday (Questmas holiday of course) on Wednesday, so the last compilation I shall do this side of the new year is on Tuesday night. Niall Davis (e-mail above) has offered to continue the compilation business up to the nineteenth of December. I would like to take you up on this offer Niall, if any mail of mine ever gets through to you! I will start again on 4th January, so there will only be a 16 day break. If you could all direct your e-mail to the correct person I would be much appreciated. That was the 'this' part. The 'that' part is a comment on my turn. I managed to get some powders in a robbery! Hehe... been trying for ages. Then I just happened to pick up some more powder from the road, which I wouldn't have got if the city guard hadn't chucked me out for being bad. :) I have a catch up turn, so the Dark Oak battle should be through by Tuesday (for those who are remotely interested)! The 'other' part is just for me to say good bye for now! See you Monday, if not tomorrow if I get some more post through. >>-Josh-> Up