BSE Digest V1 #23 From: kerry@io.com (Kerry Harrison) Date: Mon, 05 Dec 1994 00:17:37 +0000 BSE Digest Sunday, 4 December 1994 Volume 01 : Number 023 In this issue: + Re: BSE: Cargo Carrier = Carg... + Re: BSE: Quarantine of Nopthree + BSE: Cargo Carriers + BSE: Enough! + Re: BSE: Enough! See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the bse-list or bse-digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ccharnle@m-net148.arbornet.org (Chip Charnley) Date: Sat, 3 Dec 94 23:24 EST Subject: Re: BSE: Cargo Carrier = Carg... >The ship list I am talking are the official ones. The GM list. > >The CC, at this moment in time, cannot fire offensive weapons. Irrespective >of the Delta Empire's abilities, or how they were arrived at, that is the >situation at the moment, sorry. The history notes I have are contrary to what >you guys have put forward here. Being that they are GM notes, I have to go >with em. > >Now, if you WANT the CC or some similar configuration <and I am not gonna put >in any "you can only have one of these in a battle" restrictions> to fire >weapons, have at it. > >Sorry, but there's gotta be a final ruling on this. > >Thad > > OK. Just so I have this straight, the history is of BSE is the history as Mike Popolizio wrote it irrespective of what actually was the case. I am not necessarily finding fault here. I just want to know what foundation I am standing on. Chip Charnley ------------------------------ From: btb4@Lehigh.EDU (B T Braun) Date: Sun, 04 Dec 1994 01:41:42 EST Subject: Re: BSE: Quarantine of Nopthree To: ISS PD Rico From: H. Celine, USS ...message repeats...KRAAAAK...We are Celine...ZZZZZT!...protection of citizens from themselves?...TTNEERT...ravaged by mutagenic hallucinogens... SKREEEEE...ISS policies regarding dangers accepted by explorers as a matter of course...GNNNNNERF!...translucent barriers...GNUUUUUUU...hazards of doing business...GNNNNNNOME...amorphous tables...GNOOOOOSTIC...willing to accept possible death in the pursuit of knowledge...GNNNNNNOW...Undead Gods... KZEEEEEEERT....uncertain which laws will apply...MMMMMMMMENU...meninges rotted by unknown virus...FFFFFLIZT...Proper promulgation of restrictions must precede any legal sanctions...RRRRRRRRRRITILAN...preheat oven to 425 degrees... LLLLLLLLLLLLICK...Such actions could result in citizen's reluctance to report dangerous developments...FRYYYYYYYYYL...The never ending screams of the victims...SSSLLLLLTTTT...exsanguinate with extreme prejudice...OOOOOOLFT message repeats...KREEEEEEEEEEE...We are Celine... Brad Braun btb4@lehigh.edu ///////////////////*********************************************\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ "We are here to rescue Bob the Baboon from the clutches of the evil shampoo and lipstick overlords!" -Nietzsche >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< ------------------------------ From: Phil Krauskopf <pkrauskopf@FALCON.AAMRL.WPAFB.AF.MIL> Date: Sun, 04 Dec 1994 03:25:20 -0500 Subject: BSE: Cargo Carriers I gotta agree with Thad on this one. Regardless of exactly why or how Cargo Carriers were not allow in battles, the fact remains that, historically, they have not been allowed. This isn't just a recent happening. To my knowledge, the CC, as a CC, has NEVER been used in battle, even in the most active days of the SAM. According to the history, the DE was a vessel of similar design created by an extinct faction of the SAM. Since knowledge dies with the Queen, the design of the DE was lost when the faction became extinct. Granted, this story may have been concocted by Mike, but it was accepted by the SAM at the time, and has been the premise under which these ships have always operated. Mike made a lot of arbitrary decisions in the game, but I don't think we want to go through and negate every arbitrary decision he ever made. I say, let's keep history in the past, and move forward from here. (Phil steps down from his soapbox, as the crowd rifles rotten tomatos at him). ------------------------------ From: Charles Meredith <74214.2743@compuserve.com> Date: 04 Dec 94 07:31:05 EST Subject: BSE: Enough! RTG took over this game from people that most everyone here seems to agree did a lousy job of being fair and impartial. When they did that, they received some materials that was suppose to be the way things were. In order to bring back some of the old players, they have brought back some of the stuff from older times. ABM let things happen any which way because they knew that they could make arbitrary decisions later on and they did not care who they pissed off. Enter RTG. These folks have said, and I would like to take as fact until given good reason to think otherwise, that they are doing away with the continual mucking around in player actions. They are throwing away the main game balancing mechanic that ABM was so fond of using -- arbitrary GM intervention. They must work at balancing the game in other ways; and they would probably do good in not fully revealing their plan of the future. Part of this is they have had to look at what they see in the game and work from there setting up little tid-bits of adventure plot etc. For an analogy, how many of you have been in a role-playing game (like DnD) where some new player was teleported in at the beginning of an adventure and halfway through the player says, "Oh yeah, didn't I tell you about the special ability ..., or magic item...." Some times, these are minor, other times not. Some times the GM has to make an unpopular decision to keep the game balanced for the majority of players. Specifically on this, it seems the history provided to RTG conflicts with one or more player histories. SO WHAT -- IT IS HISTORY! As a minor point of game flavor, we can all get together (perhaps at GENCON) and generate a mixture of histories and all come to call it THE HISTORY. My understanding is that this Delta Empire had some special ability with this Cargo Carrier. Does the Delta Empire still exist? If it does not, then it just does not matter -- the potential game unbalancing ability can die. It seems that the Cargo Carrier was classified as a freighter when ABM turned the game over to RTG. It should be up to them to decide if it can be otherwise. So far, RTG has not had a long enough time to be able to establish their full flavor of the game. I think they are still reacting to some of the old ABM death-traps; but doing it fairly well <g>. It seems to me that anyone looking ahead from before the transition should have expected some choas. Give them the time to sort it out! I don't think they have ever turned off the "send us your suggestions" light; but don't expect all of your suggestions (or wishes) to come true. Lastly at least for a while, if you have a disagreement with a ruling, go private with it. Public bashing, stirring up the pot, etc. just hogs the bandwidth. ------------------------------ From: ccharnle@m-net148.arbornet.org (Chip Charnley) Date: Sun, 4 Dec 94 10:37 EST Subject: Re: BSE: Enough! Charles, In essence I agree with you. My problem, at this point, is trying to figure out WHAT the history is and what the 'truth' (within BSE) is so that I can play the game and build on the current status quo. Without the current discussion, I would have made some incorrect assumptions. Where I disagree is in taking this type of thing private. *I* need to see this type of discussion to know what is going on. Perhaps we all need to be a little more accepting of rulings made by RTG such as this one for the reasons stated quite nicely in your note and not PROLONG these 'discussions' more than they need to be. Chip > RTG took over this game from people that most everyone here seems to >agree did a lousy job of being fair and impartial. When they did that, they >received some materials that was suppose to be the way things were. In order to >bring back some of the old players, they have brought back some of the stuff >from older times. ABM let things happen any which way because they knew that >they could make arbitrary decisions later on and they did not care who they >pissed off. > Enter RTG. These folks have said, and I would like to take as fact until >given good reason to think otherwise, that they are doing away with the >continual mucking around in player actions. They are throwing away the main >game balancing mechanic that ABM was so fond of using -- arbitrary GM >intervention. They must work at balancing the game in other ways; and they >would probably do good in not fully revealing their plan of the future. Part of >this is they have had to look at what they see in the game and work from there >setting up little tid-bits of adventure plot etc. > For an analogy, how many of you have been in a role-playing game (like >DnD) where some new player was teleported in at the beginning of an adventure >and halfway through the player says, "Oh yeah, didn't I tell you about the >special ability ..., or magic item...." Some times, these are minor, other >times not. Some times the GM has to make an unpopular decision to keep the game >balanced for the majority of players. > Specifically on this, it seems the history provided to RTG conflicts with >one or more player histories. SO WHAT -- IT IS HISTORY! As a minor point of >game flavor, we can all get together (perhaps at GENCON) and generate a mixture >of histories and all come to call it THE HISTORY. > My understanding is that this Delta Empire had some special ability with >this Cargo Carrier. Does the Delta Empire still exist? If it does not, then it >just does not matter -- the potential game unbalancing ability can die. It >seems that the Cargo Carrier was classified as a freighter when ABM turned the >game over to RTG. It should be up to them to decide if it can be otherwise. > So far, RTG has not had a long enough time to be able to establish their >full flavor of the game. I think they are still reacting to some of the old ABM >death-traps; but doing it fairly well <g>. It seems to me that anyone looking >ahead from before the transition should have expected some choas. Give them the >time to sort it out! I don't think they have ever turned off the "send us your >suggestions" light; but don't expect all of your suggestions (or wishes) to come >true. > Lastly at least for a while, if you have a disagreement with a ruling, go >private with it. Public bashing, stirring up the pot, etc. just hogs the >bandwidth. > > > ------------------------------ End of BSE Digest V1 #23 ************************ To subscribe to bse-digest, send the command: subscribe bse-digest in the body of a message to "Majordomo@io.com". If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe "local-bse-list": subscribe bse-digest local-bse-list@your.domain.net A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "bse-digest" in the commands above with "bse-list". Up