BSE-L Digest 26 From: kerry@freeside.fc.net (Kerry Harrison) Date: Sat, 18 Feb 1995 05:08:17 +0000 Beyond the Stellar Empire Discussion List <BSE-L@consensus.com> BSE-L Digest 26 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Starship Revisited by ccharnle@m-net148.arbornet.org (Chip Charnley) 2) Re: Money by Derek Smith <Derek_Smith.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com> 3) Rulebook by vlloyd@ima.infomail.com (Vickie Lloyd) 4) Re: tech/stellers by Alan Hatcher <ZU02380@UABDPO.DPO.UAB.EDU> 5) Re: tech/stellers by "Russell Boggs" <Russell_Boggs@isisph.com> 6) Re: Tech/Stellars by btb4@Lehigh.EDU (B T Braun) 7) Re: Starship Revisited by btb4@Lehigh.EDU (B T Braun) 8) Re: Rules Overhaul by btb4@Lehigh.EDU (B T Braun) 9) Re: Starship Revisited by btb4@Lehigh.EDU (B T Braun) 10) Re: Tech/Stellars -Reply by Phil Krauskopf <PKRAUSKOPF@FALCON.AAMRL.WPAFB.AF.MIL> 11) New Order Suggestion by Phil Krauskopf <PKRAUSKOPF@FALCON.AAMRL.WPAFB.AF.MIL> 12) Re: Money by PROTHORAX@aol.com 13) Re: Starship Revisited by Law2Be@aol.com 14) Re: tech/stellers by paulmans@tmn.com 15) Re: New Order Suggestion by "Russell Boggs" <Russell_Boggs@isisph.com> 16) Re: ICN Sunrise - Market by Law2Be@aol.com 17) Re: tech/stellers by ccharnle@m-net148.arbornet.org (Chip Charnley) 18) Re: tech/stellers by ccharnle@m-net148.arbornet.org (Chip Charnley) 19) Re: Tech/Stellars by Law2Be@aol.com 20) BSE Affiliation Numbers by Kerry Harrison <kerry@io.com> 21) Minor Problem with RTG by Kerry Harrison <kerry@io.com> 22) BSE Affiliation Listing by Kerry Harrison <kerry@io.com> 23) Re: News Flash by Richard William Chiang <richc@uclink2.berkeley.edu> 24) Re: News Flash by Richard Chiang <richc@ocf.Berkeley.EDU> 25) Re: ICN Sunrise - Market by v176@rex.uokhsc.edu (Todd D. Clapp) 26) Re: Rulebook by StephMarte@aol.com 27) Colonies Revisited by Law2Be@aol.com 28) Re: BSE-L digest 25 by Wayne Alexander <71470.344@compuserve.com> 29) QSN Lie... by Jackmyster@aol.com 30) Fwd: Tech by Jackmyster@aol.com 31) Re: Rulebook by RTGThad@aol.com 32) Re: Minor Problem with RTG by RTGThad@aol.com 33) Upcoming AFTerthoughts by Alan Hatcher <ZU02380@UABDPO.DPO.UAB.EDU> 34) Periphery Restart by Alan Hatcher <ZU02380@UABDPO.DPO.UAB.EDU> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 16 Feb 95 07:35 WET From: ccharnle@m-net148.arbornet.org (Chip Charnley) To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Starship Revisited Message-ID: <m0rf5Qx-000hbQC@m-net148.arbornet.org> *I* concur completely! A ground-up restart with nothing larger than a light cruiser available to players. Make ship BUILDING about 10 times more expensive in EVERY aspect but leave that in the game rather than having GM ship allocation. Also return SIZED deposits where eventually the deposits WILL run out in one way or another. Chip Charnley >to add my 2 cents to this whole topic, >I voted for it on CIS, and I still support Tony Messina's idea: total >ground-up reset of the entire game. wipe all aff., systems, etc.; start >everything fresh and even. If the new area is ready to roll, there's a place >to start. > >S. Mathews > > ------------------------------ Date: 16 Feb 95 11:40:20 EDT From: Derek Smith <Derek_Smith.LOTUS@crd.lotus.com> To: BSE-L <BSE-L@consensus.com> Subject: Re: Money Message-ID: <9502161635.AA08035@internet1.lotus.com> REGARDING INDIVIDUAL CURRENCIES: Albert E. Junior is absolutely correct. Individual currencies are a disaster. Consider Ancient Terran History. The fall of certain currencies in the 20th century caused political upheaval that threatened to send Earth back into howling [nuclear] barbarism again. Even before that, in what was the United States of America, there was a period when each state minted its own currency. The corruption, collapsing economies in some states, and criminal smuggling of currency across state boundaries was a political, economic, and legal nightmare. --Minister Finvarra McCabe --SMS Information Coordinator ----------------------------------------------------------------------- 'The BBC's trailer department keeps calling the OJ Simpson case "the trial of the century". Sure, OJ's a big name, but I still think the title belongs, narrowly, to Nuremberg.' --Jack Hughes, "The Independent on Sunday" ------------------------------ Date: 03 Jan 00 23:08:56 -0600 From: vlloyd@ima.infomail.com (Vickie Lloyd) To: bse-l@consensus.com Subject: Rulebook Message-ID: <5a7_9502160956@ima.infomail.com> Alright, you guys--stop making suggestions for the rulebooks because I would like to see a rulebook within the next 20 years or so. Although I now have a set-up turn, I can do nothing because no rulebook and no maps. The Bird loves Sir Arthur, but the suggestion of every government minting its own money sucks big ones. It would add a world of complications to the game that cannot be overcome in our lifetime. (OOC--look at Mexico right now.) You would have to deal with setting values, exchange rates, etc. And like I said--I wantr to see a rulebook before God retires. {B=> ########################################################################### # INTERNET UUCP GATEWAY: This message was sent from Fidonet to Internet # # via the UUCP gateway. All messages are not the # # opinions of the operator of the node of origin! # ########################################################################### ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 95 13:34:58 CST From: Alan Hatcher <ZU02380@UABDPO.DPO.UAB.EDU> To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: tech/stellers Message-ID: <9502161946.AA09608@consensus.com> On Wed, 15 Feb 95 17:45 WET Chip Charnley said: >Alan, > Believe me, I do not live with anything that has to do with ABM >mentality. That would be terminal! :-) > > Seriously, the issue here is that I have NO interest or desire to run a >merchant position. The problem is that I don't see any way of having a >serious chance to acquire the stellars to do more than class 1-2 projects >without running that kind of position. THAT I have a problem with. I'll >probably figure out a way around it. I usually do. but I DON'T like it. I >think the price tag is too high if it is the ONLY way to accomplish the task. Well, stop me if I'm wrong on this, but if you're not going to play a merchant type or government type position, then you shouldn't expect to have a lot of spare stellars on hand. You'll have to deal with the people that do have the stellars, making compromises and negotiations and generally doing everything that is supposed to go on in a role-playing game. Hell, come up to Gen-Con this August and bring a bottle of good scotch. A few good shots and I'll probably agree to finance your research projects for a great deal! :) Alan e ------------------------------ Date: 16 Feb 1995 12:13:36 U From: "Russell Boggs" <Russell_Boggs@isisph.com> To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: tech/stellers Message-ID: <n1419185624.98659@isisph.com> Reply to: RE>>tech/stellers > Seriously, the issue here is that I have NO interest or desire to run a > merchant position. The problem is that I don't see any way of having a > serious chance to acquire the stellars to do more than class 1-2 projects > without running that kind of position. THAT I have a problem with. I'll > probably figure out a way around it. I usually do. but I DON'T like it. I > think the price tag is too high if it is the ONLY way to accomplish the task. Chip, You sound like a lot of my friends; great ideas for research but they have to spend most of their time trying to find money to finance it (NIH, NSF, Am.CancerSoc.). The cash requirement sounds pretty realistic to me. You just need someone in a government to establish a granting agency. Then you can submit 20 page R01 grant applications. Oh boy! --Russ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 15:19:34 EST From: btb4@Lehigh.EDU (B T Braun) To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Tech/Stellars Message-ID: <199502162019.PAA31616@ns3-1.CC.Lehigh.EDU> Phil, First off, I couldn't agree more about the USS SAs. We've been heravily dumped on in that area for several years, including things that "officially" have existed, but that MP never seemed to get around to adding to the program. He also made some of our unique items (we researched them) invalid because he couldn't wirte the code. So, *18K a week, eh? First off, you need a class 8 colony to start with. If research is going to be viable, and sorta like Samuel Colt (make affiliations equal), huge colony requirements aren't going to work. Secondly, if the economics were truly viable in this game, a class 8 colony should produce more stellars than than in a typical week of trading. I won't run a ship for *18K/week, why run a mega colony for that? I understand that the mega colony can be run $6/month while the ship is more expensive in real $, but somehow the whole thing just seems wrong. Next, what else is this colony doing to generate those *? Is the colony still viable at that rate? It's been several months since I looked at it, but my recollection is that such a rate (paltry though it is) can not be supported for extended periods. OK, you say "then ship stuff in - you've been asking for shipping incentives, supporting a major research effort will be one of them", but if a ship won't run for *18K a week, how is the colony going to have anything left over to pay the research costs? Be seeing you, Brad Braun btb4@lehigh.edu ///////////////////*********************************************\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ Brad's Sig. File Here >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 15:27:00 EST From: btb4@Lehigh.EDU (B T Braun) To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Starship Revisited Message-ID: <199502162027.PAA61976@ns3-1.CC.Lehigh.EDU> Russ, I'm not laughing, I agree - these ideas have been kicked around for some time now. The colony growth model has been discussed, but RTG decided to not change it. Doing a "SimCity" type of thing with colonies has also been suggested, but no go. Personally, I just don't understand how running a class 8 colony should take less time than a FF. Oh well. Be seeing you, Brad Braun btb4@lehigh.edu ///////////////////*********************************************\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ Brad's Sig. File Here >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 15:30:37 EST From: btb4@Lehigh.EDU (B T Braun) To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Rules Overhaul Message-ID: <199502162030.PAA23886@ns3-1.CC.Lehigh.EDU> (noting an opprotunity to do some MP bashing) Steve, MP has was playing the enigmatic "you need to study combat results to figure out the combat system now" route. However, I began to suspect that HE didn't really understand it. Be seeing you, Brad Braun btb4@lehigh.edu ///////////////////*********************************************\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ Brad's Sig. File Here >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 15:37:08 EST From: btb4@Lehigh.EDU (B T Braun) To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Starship Revisited Message-ID: <199502162037.PAA70291@ns3-1.CC.Lehigh.EDU> Chip & Steve, It'd make me happy, but could it (reasonably) be done? As I understand it, the task of reseeding the Periphery alone would be huge. Be seeing you, Brad Braun btb4@lehigh.edu ///////////////////*********************************************\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ Brad's Sig. File Here >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 15:59:58 -0400 From: Phil Krauskopf <PKRAUSKOPF@FALCON.AAMRL.WPAFB.AF.MIL> To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Tech/Stellars -Reply Message-ID: <sf437696.095@FALCON.AAMRL.WPAFB.AF.MIL> Hi Brad, Actually, I don't think that I, personally, would choose that method for financing research. For large projects, that would be infeasible. However, if you were a poor colony governor with a relatively small project, the thing is still doable. Once you research a few smaller projects, you can use the profits selling these new items to finance progressively larger projects. And while I can understand that Chip doesn't want to play merchant, those who do can make tremendous amounts of stellars doing it. These new AFT guys have this thing down to a science. At any rate, Chip: you get me some successful research projects, and I'll make sure they get financed. Phil K. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 16:09:05 -0400 From: Phil Krauskopf <PKRAUSKOPF@FALCON.AAMRL.WPAFB.AF.MIL> To: bse-l@consensus.com Subject: New Order Suggestion Message-ID: <sf4378b6.000@FALCON.AAMRL.WPAFB.AF.MIL> One new order I'd love to have, for both colonies and ships, is "ADD EVERYONE TO MY ENEMY LIST EXCEPT..." Could anyone else use such an order? PK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 16:46:52 -0500 From: PROTHORAX@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Money Message-ID: <950216141652_23429636@aol.com> (ooc) thats a good idea?! For what it's worth would RTG consider using production to produce stellars? later david ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 17:48:43 -0500 From: Law2Be@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Starship Revisited Message-ID: <950216154431_23504734@aol.com> Steve, Chip, Both of you forget this was tried in '91. Perhaps if you really tried, a way may be found to collapse the new jump connections so the draconian area stays seperate and ya'll could move out there. I for one like living in an advanced society, and thoughly enjoy the complexity and oddities that make up the Periphery. You don't kill a 14 year old just because you liked him better when he was still young and little...... Rick Burningham ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 23:29:37 GMT From: paulmans@tmn.com To: bse-l@consensus.com Subject: Re: tech/stellers Message-ID: <199502162329.XAA24412@purple.tmn.com> Russ, What a great idea!!! All we have to do is invent a bureaucracy to handle all research projects, so that the expense can be justified! Paul ------------------------------ Date: 16 Feb 1995 15:36:31 U From: "Russell Boggs" <Russell_Boggs@isisph.com> To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: New Order Suggestion Message-ID: <n1419173446.29851@isisph.com> Reply to: RE>New Order Suggestion RE: ADD EVERYONE TO MY ENEMY LIST EXCEPT I think it's a good idea. But then I always was paranoid. --Russ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 18:38:15 -0500 From: Law2Be@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: ICN Sunrise - Market Message-ID: <950216151711_23480720@aol.com> OK guys, After you get the atmosphere thing sorted out, could you tell us if it's safe to land and service our outposts, provided we do not "expose ourselves" to the atmosphere. How about use of the startport facilities if we use the on-board vacc suits? Perhaps the guvnr, or the ISS could clear this up?? Capt. Richard Petty SMS RACECARS4EVER ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 95 18:56 WET From: ccharnle@m-net148.arbornet.org (Chip Charnley) To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: tech/stellers Message-ID: <m0rfG3v-000hfBC@m-net148.arbornet.org> > Well, stop me if I'm wrong on this, but if you're not going to play a >merchant type or government type position, then you shouldn't expect to have a >lot of spare stellars on hand. You'll have to deal with the people that do >have the stellars, making compromises and negotiations and generally doing >everything that is supposed to go on in a role-playing game. Hell, come up to >Gen-Con this August and bring a bottle of good scotch. A few good shots and >I'll probably agree to finance your research projects for a great deal! :) > > > > Alan e > > Actually, I WILL be playing (and am playing) government positions. However, it has been my experience that GOVT positions are not exactly rolling in stellars. Beyond that, I WILL be at GENCON. Benn there for the past 4 years and at every ORIGINS save one in CA prior to that back to 1981. See you there (unless you happen to be at CONcentric in the same general vicinity (Chicago) MAR 2-5 in which case I'll see you there first). Chip ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 95 18:56 WET From: ccharnle@m-net148.arbornet.org (Chip Charnley) To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: tech/stellers Message-ID: <m0rfG42-000hfCC@m-net148.arbornet.org> > Then you >can submit 20 page R01 grant applications. Oh boy! >--Russ > > > Gee! Thanks Russ! Sounds like LOTS of fun gaming there! :`) Chip ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 19:50:08 -0500 From: Law2Be@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Tech/Stellars Message-ID: <950216190527_23683010@aol.com> Brad, If your merchants are making over *18k a week, then some colony governors are raking in some bucks. Also don't forget, something that costs *100k to bring about may not produce much money, but something that costs *1.2m should bring in a hefty price down the road. It does take money to provide training, retooling, and the like for a new product, so I don't see it as totally unreasonable. Bring in mind that the research colonies will have to be subsidised by the affiliations because of the reduced production cabability. This will enhance trade, cooperation within affiliations, and extra-affiliation cooperation as well. I am working on one such deal already. Those governors that do not want to deal with the stellar payment do have another viable option: deal exclusivly with feasability studies which they then sell directly to research colonies. This way the research facilities do get used, but only for positive cash flow. I for one will always be interested at feasability studies for sale! All the proposals have advantages and disadvantages, the trick is to maximize the former, and minimize the later. The above is one example (sell feasability studies). The biggest factor that is going for us at the current time is an administration willing to consider, and work for change (and I'm not talking IMPs <g>). I would like to see more proposals about how to maximize potential under the new rules, rather than bellyaching about how they don't make your position greater. That's my opinion, Lord Tennesee Ford SMS Chattanooga ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 19:57:29 -0600 (CST) From: Kerry Harrison <kerry@io.com> To: BSE Mailing List <bse-l@consensus.com> Subject: BSE Affiliation Numbers Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9502161954.A21720-0100000@pentagon.io.com> Affiliation Scorecard 1 - ISP (Imperial Stellar Patrol) 2 - IMP (Imperial Colonies) 3 - ITS (Imperial Transport Service) 4 - ICN (Imperial Capellan Navy) 5 - ISS (Imperial Transport Service) 6 - STC (Supragalactic Treasury Corporation) 7 - GTT (Galactic Transport and Trade) 8 - SMS (Stellar Mining and Smelting) 9 - SSL (Solar Spices and Liquors) 10 - FET (Frontier Exploration and Trade) 11 - WCE (Whitehole Colonial Empire) 12 - USS (Universal Sciences and Service) 13 - AFT (Association of Free Traders) 14 - IND (Independents) 15 - DER (Derelicts) 16 - TRN (Trainees) 17 - RIP (Raiders of the Imperial Periphery) 18 - EEM (Empire Engineering and Manufacturing) 19 - DTR (Detinus Republic) 20 - TCA (Trans-Canally Alliance) 21 - REP (Republicans) 22 - BAR (Barots) 23 - SAM (Samillian Empire) 24 - WSP (Warring Samillian Pompillidae) 25 - QSN (Quman Space Navy) 26 - FGZ (Flagritz Republics) 27 - CAT (Catrark) 28 - SLD (Samillian Legion of Destiny) 29 - AIS (AIFS, Artificial Intelligences of Far Swinette) 30 - DTN (Destructons) 31 - KSN 32 - FOE (Foelian Empire) 33 - KAS (Kastorians) 34 - PFM (Pennockan Federal Meritocracy) 35 - UNK (Unknown) 36 - EKN (Ekinos) 37 - PGJ (Pan Galactic Jihad) 38 - HDN (Hunters of the New Dawn) 39 - ZCS (Zolmani Consolidated Systems) 40 - MYR (Myrrians) 41 - POL 42 - VVC 43 - 44 - 45 - ROC (Republic of Corona) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 20:02:31 -0600 (CST) From: Kerry Harrison <kerry@io.com> To: BSE Mailing List <bse-l@consensus.com> Subject: Minor Problem with RTG Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9502162013.B22630-0100000@pentagon.io.com> Thad & Pete, I do wish y'all would remember to include the bloody planet maps from Probe Planet orders, this is twice in a round that haven't received maps for worlds I've probed. Kerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 22:08:10 -0600 (CST) From: Kerry Harrison <kerry@io.com> To: BSE Mailing List <bse-l@consensus.com> Subject: BSE Affiliation Listing Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9502162259.A8117-0100000@pentagon.io.com> Affiliation Scorecard 1 - ISP (Imperial Stellar Patrol) 2 - IMP (Imperial Colonies) 3 - ITS (Imperial Transport Service) 4 - ICN (Imperial Capellan Navy) 5 - ISS (Imperial Transport Service) 6 - STC (Supragalactic Treasury Corporation) NPC 7 - GTT (Galactic Transport and Trade) 8 - SMS (Stellar Mining and Smelting) 9 - SSL (Solar Spices and Liquors) 10 - FET (Frontier Exploration and Trade) 11 - WCE (Whitehole Colonial Empire) 12 - USS (Universal Sciences and Service) 13 - AFT (Association of Free Traders) 14 - IND (Independents) 15 - DER (Derelicts) NPC 16 - TRN (Trainees) 17 - RIP (Raiders of the Imperial Periphery) 18 - EEM (Empire Engineering and Manufacturing) 19 - DTR (Detinus Republic) 20 - TCA (Trans-Canally Alliance) inactive 21 - REP (Republicans) NPC 22 - BAR (Barots) NPC 23 - SAM (Samillian Empire) 24 - WSP (Warring Samillian Pompillidae) 25 - QSN (Quman Space Navy) 26 - FGZ (Flagritz Republics) 27 - CAT (Catrark) NPC 28 - SLD (Samillian Legion of Destiny) inactive 29 - AIS (AIFS, Artificial Intelligences of Far Swinette) NPC 30 - DTN (Destructons) inactive 31 - KSN ? 32 - FOE (Foelian Empire) 33 - KAS (Kastorians) NPC 34 - PFM (Pennockan Federal Meritocracy) 35 - UNK (Unknown) NPC 36 - EKN (Ekinos) 37 - PGJ (Pan Galactic Jihad) 38 - HDN (Hunters of the New Dawn) inactive 39 - ZCS (Zolmani Consolidated Systems) 40 - MYR (Myrrians) 41 - POL (Polesotechnic League) inactive 42 - VVC (Vanguard Venture Corporation) inactive 43 - BIG (Business Investors Guild) inactive 44 - PTE (Phoenix Trade & Exploration) inactive 45 - ROC (Republic of Corona) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 20:10:36 -0800 (PST) From: Richard William Chiang <richc@uclink2.berkeley.edu> To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: News Flash Message-ID: <Pine.3.89.9502162013.A7621-0100000@uclink2.berkeley.edu> On Wed, 15 Feb 1995 Law2Be@aol.com wrote: > Now Richard, > The Qumans would not fire on a diplomatic vessel......would they? > probably not. but how am i suppose to tell the difference? i have warned all the fgz to stay out of qsn colonies. since this meeting never really happened on alippon there is no problem. but if it did then at least 3 colonies fired on the fgz and the den of earth is dead. and that is enough fightning for me. richard ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 20:24:40 -0800 (PST) From: Richard Chiang <richc@ocf.Berkeley.EDU> To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: News Flash Message-ID: <Pine.APO.3.91.950216202337.5107A-100000@drought.berkeley.edu> On Wed, 15 Feb 1995, Kerry Harrison wrote: > > On Tue, 14 Feb 1995, Richard Chiang wrote: > > > except they really want their citizens back that were enslaved by the fgz. > > You obviously haven't been keeping up with current events. > or it is even funnier how rumors get spread with only a thin thread connecting them to reality. richard ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Feb 1995 23:06:37 -0600 (CST) From: v176@rex.uokhsc.edu (Todd D. Clapp) To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: ICN Sunrise - Market Message-ID: <9502170506.AA21174@rex.re.uokhsc.edu> I knew that the gas was a hydrocarbon and my scientists tell me that it may be a bio-weapon or a terraforming agent. They also tell me that it continually changes. Other than that the gas continues to thwart their best efforts to characterize it. I have rechecked all of my IMP files and find no reference to Ekill. The only thing that even reffered to this area was the Tesni system - No Imp directives. If the ISP PD or the ISS PD have information to the contrary then I would be glad to hear it. Finally this thing about not being able to leave the planet after being exposed to the gas is news to me. I have had marines off exploring the planet and then these same marines participated in the attack on RIP Slave Pit 3. Granted these same marines stayed in their spacesuits and were careful about exposure to the atmosphere. I will defer to the IMP Admiralty about whether or not other persons should be allowed to explore the planet surface. Finally on trade, ICN Sunrise is an enclosed colony and in the year that I have controlled this colony no Starship has had problems leaving the colony. Also no ill effects have been reported by any Starship Captain. The colony also has a Hiport for those merchants who choose not to possibly be exposed to the atmoshphere. Our markets are open and waiting for all peaceful traders. Minister Todd Clapp ICN Sunrise ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 00:15:32 -0500 From: StephMarte@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Rulebook Message-ID: <950216220208_23845482@aol.com> Maddie, Aw shucks, I love you too Big Bird. <g> I don't think my suggestion about each government establishing it's own currency would fly in this system because you'd have to have a handle on the money supply, something that just wouldn't work under the current system - where unused manpower converts into stellars. The Orion Nebula allowed each government to set its own money supply, and i thought it added an interesting aspect to play. But of course, where is the Orion Nebula today? <sound of flushing toilet> Regards, Arthur ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 00:48:37 -0500 From: Law2Be@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Colonies Revisited Message-ID: <950216221850_23862151@aol.com> I hate to say it, but looking back, Russ may be right in that we need to restore finite deposits. Outside of the fact this more closely resembles reality, it tends to encourage both new exploration and trade. The existing colonies would be like the U.S. now. We have become less dependent on domesticly produced raw materials than in the past, and more dependent on using technology and export/imports. The existing colonies would provide the base for meaningful research and manufacturing, while creating a demand for ores from ever expanding exploration of new space. This would mean RTG would have to put in new frontiers now and then to satisfy demand, and this may tax the systems ability to track all the neccessary data. (hopefully the P6 will come out in time.) It would be a lot of work, and would require the transition to a more realistic economic model, but could open up new ways of playing hard to imagine at the current time. The creation of robotisized ore carriers to act as interstellar RTS links may become necessary, but someone still has to find/setup the outposts. Along the way the explorers would be subject to all the fun we enjoy in the TH, TC, and DV, and in the inner space we would still have the "power play" we indulge in now. This post is meant to show that this idea would require an immense effort on the part of RTG should this policy be enacted, and that it may in fact be too much. On the other hand, it would revolutionize the game by requiring a more agressive attitude towards finding/exploiting natural resources, and discovering new techs. How involved do you want the macro-economic model to be? Just because the macro-economics got complex, does not mean each player would become swamped. It just means you have to keep one step ahead of the deposits, and would force the current mega colonies to compete in the marketplace, or be broken down for transfer to the outlying areas. I think I've touched on enough that those of you proficient in economics, game theory, programming, or sociology can make specific recommendations regarding possible implementation. PEOPLE---Please take the time to consider the overall implications of a proposed change. RTG would like to make the fundamental changes as seldom as possible, and retain the flavor of the game as much as possible. The concept of a truly functioning economy could be a Pandoras Box. Thats my opinion for the afternoon, Rick Burningham ------------------------------ Date: 17 Feb 95 01:21:17 EST From: Wayne Alexander <71470.344@compuserve.com> To: "INTERNET:BSE-L@consensus.com" <BSE-L@consensus.com> Subject: Re: BSE-L digest 25 Message-ID: <950217062116_71470.344_EHB30-1@CompuServe.COM> TO: Chip Charnley FM: Wayne Alexander [IC] Sir, Politics and boundaries aside the Kriegers have always been strong and avid supporters of the arts and sciences. The Krieger Foundation would be more than willing to discuss grants for your research projects. We are well aware of your achievements in the past and your potential for the future. We feel that such an intellect should not go wanting for a mere lack of lucre. Axl Krieger, SBIC Krieger Foundation ------------------------------------------------------------------------ TO: Albert E. Junior FM: Lord Stu Krieger, EEM CEO RE: Common currency Mr. Junior, Ditto what you said, and well said it was. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- TO: The T3 FM: Lord Stu Krieger, EEM CEO RE: Transhole changes The EEM and the KGB applauds *any* consolidating effort that stabilizes and "civilizes" any of the various galactic marketplaces. We wish you bobspeed and best hopes for a successful alliance. It is as the Oracle of Schmink foretold, "Yea, ye shall eateth of the Holy Dog and sit down on your self-sharpening pedestals. And a great change shall come from outside." I have no idea what that means, but the Oracle said so it must be true, and is somehow strangely appropriate. Good luck. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- TO: Star Admiral von Ludendorf, ISP PD FM: Star Admiral Dax Krieger, EEM Kaisergard RE: Hoffa & Horn Saw a ITS freighter the other day with a "Where is J. Hoffa?" bumper sticker. Nice shootin' and congratulations to your Immortals for reassigning Mr. Hoffa. I do a favor to ask, when you get around to pulling the switch on pirate Horn I'd appreciate being there. You'll let me know, right? Thanks. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 01:57:41 -0500 From: Jackmyster@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: QSN Lie... Message-ID: <950216231325_23915461@aol.com> I sent this message to Richard Monday night...I did not receive any type of responce...I think it's pretty much self-explainitory....(for all you who think I attacked an inactive position.... Subj: QSN Lie... Date: 95-02-13 19:17:54 EST From: Jackmyster To: richc@uclink2.berkeley.edu Richard: I received confirmation today that the two Sols that I attacked on 194.52 at 1647 in Merolla, were in fact at 1547 on 194.44...my conversation with Tom occurred prior to that, as my ship(s) that I was sending to Not Here were avoiding that area. (prior to 44) Either way, a "scan" puts them there on week 44....So, how "inactive" were they? They could have easily left FGZ space, but choose not to... So, why am I telling you? Because I am unclear as to whether you are also prop agating this lie, or have just been (deliberately) misinformed by those who are responsible... (I know what it is like to be "fed" misinformation and end up with egg on your face) Public knowledge of this would create a backlash, not only for the QSN but also for you personally. Therefore, I will allow you two days before I take this information public and allow you to look into it. If I do not here from you (in some fashion) by Wens. night, I will post a copy of this note on the BSE List. (sound familiar?<g>) I know that Barry is hard to get a hold of, but I also know that if you want to...you can. I also know that if you request additional time from me...I will give it to you, if there is a legitament reason... I do not personally care how the QSN "look" to others (it will serve my purposes to make this known) however, I would rather save Tom some embarrisment if possible. Although I plan on destroying every position he has <g> I still consider him OOC, a friend. Upon discloser of this, I will expect an public apology from the QSN Leadership.... Bests- J. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 02:30:42 -0500 From: Jackmyster@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Fwd: Tech Message-ID: <950216231330_23915500@aol.com> FYI: --------------------- Forwarded message: Subj: Tech Date: 95-02-15 01:56:51 EST From: RTG Thad To: Jackmyster Jack- After checking the code, the aff tech will not get captured after the colony falls, as the tech is linked to aff and once it changes, the tech goes away. Sorry for the confusion. This also means that aff tech cannot be transferred.... Thad ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 05:33:47 -0500 From: RTGThad@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Rulebook Message-ID: <950217023027_24079077@aol.com> The rulebook will be out shortly before God retires or thereabouts <g> We hope that no sleep, no food and nicotine withdrawal on my pasrt will speed the process a bit so's that it happems before the end of the month or thereabouts.... Thad ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 05:41:40 -0500 From: RTGThad@aol.com To: BSE-L@consensus.com Subject: Re: Minor Problem with RTG Message-ID: <950217023634_24083276@aol.com> I thought you weren't playing at the moment how could we forget to include planet maps? We have an awfully vigorous way of checking planet maos, but we may have missed them. What position/when/wher/what and I'll send em out. Thad ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Feb 95 04:37:55 CST From: Alan Hatcher <ZU02380@UABDPO.DPO.UAB.EDU> To: BSE Digest <bse-l@consensus.com> Subject: Upcoming AFTerthoughts Message-ID: <9502171044.AA12364@consensus.com> Greetings People of BSE, I hope to publish the 2nd issue of 195 of AFTerthoughts sometime in the next few weeks, and I hope to go up to 4 pages this time. In order to do so I'm soliciting contributions of any type to go into it. Send me your in-charac ter news reports or small advertisements or letters to the editor and I'll almost guarantee they'll make it in. I hope to have a friendly rivalry with the CPT going, so send in your stuff! Alan Hatcher zu02380@uabdpo.dpo.uab.edu 1981 Rock School Road Harpersville AL 35078 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Feb 95 04:42:55 CST From: Alan Hatcher <ZU02380@UABDPO.DPO.UAB.EDU> To: BSE Digest <bse-l@consensus.com> Subject: Periphery Restart Message-ID: <9502171050.AA12451@consensus.com> My vote is a firm NO on restarting the game. With the new areas opening up I think there is plenty of room for people who want new things and those happy with the way things are to co-exist. I think what the game really needs is more new players to help use up all those resources out there. There are a lot of places I want to explore that are just in the basic periphery, and besides, things being unbalanced creates interesting role-playing possibilities. In summary, I don't feel that the problems are big enough to require huge fixes at this point. The upcoming rule changes address most of the current problems, and I think we need to give them a chance to be implemented. Alan ------------------------------ End of BSE-L Digest 26 ********************** Up