Quest Digest 13/5/95 From: ">>-Josh->" <J.P.Gallagher@durham.ac.uk> Date: Sat, 13 May 1995 00:00:00 +0000 ____________________________________________________________________ | | | THE QUEST DIGEST | | The forum for the E-mailing Quest-players | | Compiled by Josh Gallagher: J.P.Gallagher@durham.ac.uk | | Date: 13 May 1995 | |____________________________________________________________________| o This is not an automatically generated compilation, so if all contributions could be sent to me in a seperate e-mail with paragraphs initialled, I would appreciate it a lot. o Please do not use this list for your own purposes; people do not appreciate thousands of pieces of mail arriving a day! o If you ever want taking off the list, just say, and I will be happy to do so. I don't want telling off for any nuisance mail! o All material here is the exclusive property of the author and may not be used elsewhere without their permission. JPG> Hard at work revising.. Hehe.. making anyone feel guilty? :-) Well, I have but one small point to make before we start, and quite a serious one at that. I would like to request that people do not personally flame others, just flame what they say... Tell me if this is too much to ask... This is for Quest purposes only, and if something someone says offends you that bad, take it out on them in private email. That being said, on with the messages... -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quest Helpline service. This helpline is chaired a by a panel of experienced Quest players, who will be available to answer any queries or solve any problems to do with Quest. Send e-mail to <godfrey2@cov.ac.uk> and give "Quest help" as the subject line. Contact me if you want to join the panel. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: DEAN P R SHEARS <eeshears@swansea.ac.uk> Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 13:02:23 GMT0BST DS> Just so none of you hopeful recruiters lose hope, In around 10 attempts, I have picked up, EM 52 sk, EM 53 sk, EM 48 sk, EM 56 sk, EM 56 sk, and another elf mage on 59 skill. All without Luck of Novala, Bless, etc and usually with a +22 Sundonak Alignment. All of these loverly mages were picked up for the mere pitance of 1001 gold pieces so keep at it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 May 1995 16:07:30 GMT From: Paul Noble <editor@elbon.demon.co.uk> > EJ I have recently trained my BT upto 99 skill by turn 17 (in game 16), can > anyone beat this or is this a record ? PN> I got my BT to 68sk 89aw this turn the 18th (it should be 70odd and 96aw but the buy orders never made it). My first 99 (except for ice creams and stuff) anything ever is Slime Cult in G6, 99 awareness, sniff, sniff. PN> See the latest KJC news? They are stopping the retraction of mistake turns, so if you find you're accidentally going to fuck your entire group, you can't change it, and you still have to pay for it! It may not be their fault, it may always be the players, but I thought they wanted to provide a friendly service. The questionaires about service and stuff may ask the wrong questions. ie was the phone service polite? It has never been discourtioues but it has been utterly useless and done nothing to save your turn. Perhaps a 'What do you think of KJCs attitude towards player requests? is it A)Excellent, you got what you wanted B)Courteous in explaining why what ever happened, happened? c)Crap. > CC> Hear, hear! I've got two 100+ turn groups and one 70 turn group and > life is BORING. I haven't the heart to engage groups with E orders > because I'd wipe them out (exceptions for groups with general hostiles or > groups who annoy me!). PN> I know of one group in G8 that is a bit annoyed with the Luggage, they moved before they could be stolen from. Quite peeved he was. > I also agree that it might be easier to have two 'digests', the first with info > and comments on quest in general, the second with game specific info, but then I > don't do the editing. PN> I think it would most definitly have to be 2 digests, As it is this is a sort of ideas/slag em off area, the game messages just seem out of place. > see if the postal strike here in Edinburgh has cost me a TQ for one party and > another quest for my other. PN> You may be able to still take on the quest, just ask KJC if the quest has been taken up by anyone else yet. > shops I have investigated don't sell it? Can you confirm? PN> G3 has only 5 places, G9 I know of 4 places, I think all games upward of 12 or 13 have magic skill in all settlements. > AH> Before I go - the inputter who used to leave notes at the end of your > turn, saying your letters were read and what was done about it, > was Sarah - you know, the one KJC dont employ any more. PN> Kirsty puts 'Thank you for the Newsletter' on the bottom of mine when I send in Burning Detritus. JPG> Hey, I got one input by '???'... interesting on a birth certificate that one... -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Stefan Andersson <t94stean@und.ida.liu.se> Date: Wed, 10 May 95 18:05:49 +0200 SA> Wow, quite a frequence you have on your Digest-releases, give us some time to read the first one before we get a new! :-) Felt like I should comment some of the latest entries (now when I finally have finished issue 32 of my newsletter). SA> First, everyone who want to can visit my homepage at: http://www.edu.isy.liu.se/~z94stean/ ...it's not much more than some links yet, but I'm working on it. I had plans on a Quest area, but now other seem to have the same idea, so I don't have to do it. SA> I have also been a victim of the bad service from KJC lately. I don't know what kind of creature they have employed in the mail-room, but I didn't get one of my turns until today, faaaar to late, and not from KJC, but from another Swedish player I didn't know of. He was very kind sending me my turn-result, but what if they had been sent to a not that honest person, using my account number and maybe sending copies of my group stats to enemies? No, this can't be tolerated, and I am going to make this clear for the KJC staff (which I so far have had high thoughts about, always solving the problems). >PN> To SA, please stop selling your 8 Dogs here. SA> Selling? How many players from game six are on this mailing-list? How many of them do you think already are members of the Eight Gods? The non- members is a rarer sight, that's for sure! :-D >SA> Another thing struck me. Why don't start to offer temple quests for >beasts in a nearby dungeon too?.................. >JPG> Here's one: The livelihood of what?? The old hermit who lives down >the dungeon and avoids civilisation? Other monsters who try to >peacefully cohabit? SA> Hey, monsters can move out of the dungeon and do raids, while they LIVE on a dungeon level! At least it would be more challenging then the Accept-quest-enter-wilderness-kill-monsters-enter-town-get-reward that is possible to do in one turn... -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 May 1995 09:33:38 +0100 (BST) From: Lord of Spoons <A.O.Hooper@herts.ac.uk> > JPG> Exams exams exams... but I'm not stressed... no, really... AH> Dont remind me, please..... > PN> My G3 group was going to be the run of the mill type cast > Londoner Yuppie, you know, filofaxes etc. The Battle cry was to > be ... Oi, Slags, Shat it! it came out.... O'slags Shut up. > Slightly camp methinks. AH> I tried to get "the words 'backstabbing' and 'bastards' come to mind" in Skulking Vermins PP but they ***'d out bastards. Looks like group names like Leather Clad Bitches can go in, as can Big Bollocks but not bastards - which in my dictionary means "someone underhandly cunning" amongst other things. Oh well. > PN> Whats the Unicorn thing? AH> Read the Unicorn blurb - they are the icon of good in most fantasy worlds. It used to really get on 'good' allainces nerves to admit to hunting and killing them. Unfortunatly the latest bunch of 'good' groups cast Call Monster/kill/maim/pillage as much as us evil types....sad really. > PN> What happens if you just put in a X 22 Gonk join order and > you havn't even issued a J order? AH> I accidently accepted the wrong quest once - I had to kill a Dark Oak but I had no idea where it was! I zapped it next turn. > From: ui99@rz.uni-karlsruhe.de (Roland Ottl) > Just a short note here for that monster value list: > SEER 1620gold 7sectors south + 9sectors east AH> Wow! - want to swap it for my 200gp's for 3 cavemen? No I dint think you would <G>. > CC> You don't want to hear about the three I've got at 55 skill for 1000 > gps, do you? <EG> AH> <sob sniffle wail> I hate you, I hate you, I hate you. Just wait until I get a 99sk EM for 50gp's, just you wait then you'll all be sorry....pahahahahahahaha I shall have my REVENGE! > CC> If anyone wants to quote my FAQ or spread it around, but KEEP MY > NAME ON IT. Or I will get very annoyed. You won't like that. AH> What? Christi...ooops. Ahem. Chris will get annoyed? I dont belive that for one moment. <ducks behind blast doors and cowers in a corner>. > CC> Friend of mine tried to hand all his hides to the Town Council, got > inputted as give gold and 13 members each gave 464 gps. AH> My original group in G2, back, back in the mists of time, were dropped because I tried to start a new group. Can you guess what happened? All the orders for the new group happened to my old group, quickly followed a catch up turn with my original orders - which led to everything being messed up. They cherry on the cake being the message at the top of the turn saying "please fill in your group# and group name correctly next turn". I have a two very nice turns at home which consists mainly of "a trip to a nearby town would bring us closer to shops" and "you can only recruit characters in towns". I quit in disgust for a year before comming back. > JPG> I can confirm that in game 11 I haven't found any yet either... > still working on it though... AH> G3 has but six places to that sell mage skill. 4 cities and 2 towns. BTW it took me yonks to find a place that flogged it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 May 1995 15:45:32 From: dynamic@dynamic.DIALix.oz.au (Peter Read) G'day Players, >NB> And you're still in business? Surely if you had no players, you >wouldn't make as much money? Peter, please let us hear your >description of the perfect, player-free PBM game? > If I had said the worst thing about PBM was the Postal service, would you think I was suggesting playing PBM without a postal service???? Naturally no, I was merely pointing out that a lot of our problems are caused by players themselves. >CC> I am neither gentle nor a man Sincerest apologies. Obviously you aren't a lady either since ladies are gentle and don't read mail that's not addressed to them. >CC> I'm not denying I ever cock-up a turn and when I have rang KJC about >that major booboo they have been more than helpful. However "Any errors >are the fault of the player" doesn't cut much ice with me. If you can say I doubt if it cuts much ice with anyone. Who on earth would issue such a stupid statement? >CC> Good, very nice but how many staff actually play in a game they Both of us play our games for a short time to ensure we know enough about them to a) fix up obvious errors we see and b) to enable us to answer questions about the games. >CC> Then get out of the F*#@ing business. I'm sorry, but that is so >ARROGANT! Older players know better than to ring up the GM especially I was right to begin, you definitely aren't a lady! >CC> Too late. Personally, you sound as if you really can't be arsed. So >give up. You appear to be such an expert, drawing conclusions and reading in things that aren't even hinted at. Maybe you should produce a book entitled "How to become the Perfect Person like I am" >CC> Guess which company I won't be playing with in the future. Thank heavens for small mercies. Regards Peter Read. GM of Dynamic Games in Australia. (JPG> _That_ was the kind of thing I was talking about) -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 May 1995 22:26:37 +0100 (BST) From: "C.H.E.B." <ctc@coventry.ac.uk> > bv> I am all in favour of improving cities in several ways. > My idea for moderating play around towns while still allowing it to take > place even inside a city, is to have the city guards intervene. The more > law and order in the city, the sooner they react. They will be reluctant to > intervene outside the walls, but if somebody start a major fight just outside > they could make a sally. Being trained formation fighters, they should be > able to subdue and drive away even very tough parties. They will of course > have polearms, and will in formation appear to have a VERY efficient > armour but not too high weapons skill. Outside the city, they drive > aggressive groups away from the city. Inside, they can evict or arrest > groups depending on the city and the severity of the disturbance. > Arrested groups are fined and then evicted. CC> Interesting. Anything which results in interesting opponents is fine by me. Has anyone come up with any ideas what to do with 100+ turn old groups yet (and don't say weapons training, I've got 12 chars on ACE - the other three are mages, before you ask). > To curb the use of miracles, I suggest that all temples have a zone of > alignment spells a little, and dampen opposite alignment spells somewhat and CC> Interesting again, but I can't see Steve programming it. I can't see why the catacombes couldn't be done fairly soon, though. Basically, they'd be a dungeon with tougher monsters (IE variations on a current theme) with a entry level made up of character stats (IE number of chars, weapons ability - NOT SKILL - and exp). > If weather was introduced to Quest, it could affect movement and > sighting distances somewhat. Rain would also wash out tracks. This > should be fairly simple to implement, and could be added in gradually. CC> I question that that sentance; I would have though that something would be very difficult to impliment. > It would add an unknown to movement rate, especially off roads, and > might open up a new area for low-level magic and miracles. CC> And would irritate the hell out of questers. Imagine losing that quarry because some idiot (nothing personal, Steve - just a phrase) decided that it would rain that day! > Date: Fri, 05 May 1995 21:25:07 > From: dynamic@dynamic.DIALix.oz.au (Peter Read) > G'day Gentlemen, CC> Why has this bilge been repeated? > AH> In the last Digest a lot of people mentioned that KJC are not all > *that* bad. I agree they are still good but not up to the standards they > were two or so years ago (or four, when I first played Quest). Back then CC> I think that was the point of most posts. As was the lack of reaction from any corrections. > CC> That questionnaire is a bit simplictic. How about turn performance > over a month? > > JPG> The questionnaire was meant to be simple, and easy to follow/reply > to so that people weren't put off answering it. Also, as stated in the > questionnaire (as far as I remember!) it was intended to be replied to 3 > times, for your next 3 turns. I will send the questionnaire out again in CC> Oops you can't expect me to READ what you send, can you? > NPO> I got my turn through today.... I had ordered my thief > Rob Daman to take a shot at a Jewellers, with 2 lucks and a > Novala spirit as backup of course! Well I can report CC> No point doing more than 1 Luck. > NPO> Does anybody out there, know of any Quest WWW sites.... > in game six. So bloody well send me your stuff so there will be! > I would very much Like to have that FAQ on there Chris CC> Over the holidays - too many courseworks at the mo. It requires a major rewrite. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: maximus@IAEhv.nl (Frank Maximus) Date: Fri, 12 May 1995 01:52:40 +0200 (MET DST) >EL>"Fortunately" (NOT) this is not only a KJC-problem. My friend > Emiel Wanders (he gets this digest too, so: "hi Emiel") is > playing the game at PBM Express in Holland (like me) and he is > also waiting for a turn he sent 4 weeks ago (give or take a week). > Phonecalls do not seem a remedy. This is already the second time > it happened. ..... Makes you think about quitting Quest... doesn't > it ? Keep on hoping for better times! Greetz.... Edwin FM> Hey... It didn't happen to me till now! Okay... some days.. (max 5 AND it was a catch up turn, but....) If I don't get my turn within 7 days after the 1st 'next turn'dates I use my phone and wouldn't wait to GET my turn! And Yes, I play at THE NETHERLANDS with PBM-EXpress.. (Game 1 & 2) >The homepage will be: http://www.iaehv.nl/users/maximus/quest.html >The 1st release will be at Monday evening (MET) 15 May 1995 ----------- ------- ----------- There already lots of people loojing for this page... but I said: 15 May. That's the day I upload it! nothing earlier! :-) (Sorry guys and girls) >JPG> This was snipped from an email to me, (hope you don't mind, >Frank!). I haven't checked out the page yet, but will do soon.... I'll >get a link to it from my own homepage soon... Josh... 15 May... okay? JPG> *grins* okay.. Frank Maximus -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 12 May 95 10:20:04 MEZ From: CHBRIN5@nyx.uni-konstanz.de KH> I understand that Quest has become boring to some older players, but I still think that you are being unfair to KJC. Try to look at it in another way: Quest becomes boring after 100+ turns. If you have never played Quest before and don't get all the information from the FAQs, the spell lists and the digest, it will probably take 150 or 200 turns before Quest becomes boring. Now at one turn per week, 100 turns are TWO YEARS of playing| How many other games do you know that stay interesting for two years before becoming boring? KH> Only face-to-face roleplaying games could possibly keep you happy even longer. I've tried a lot of play-by-mail games and only Austerlitz and Quest have kept me playing for more than a year. I did quit Monster Island, Trangrad, Railway, Duell, Gladius et Pilum, Nordic Rings, Polis and some other games after about a year. I looked at, but didn't even start, Legends, El Mythico and a dozen or so SF games. To the best of my knowledge there is NO game that is better than Quest. Plus Quest is the least expensive game from all of the above. KH> Of course I'm quite willing to play (and test) other games, if you can name a play-by-mail game that is, in your opinion, better than Quest. If anybody really thinks that Quest is "bullshit", he is free to vote with his feet and leave KJC. That would not only be logical, but is probably the only language any company understand. But I think that Quest has become better over the years, not worse. But any exploration games virtually ends the moment you have explored everything. And you would need a dozen or more programmers to extend Quest faster than people explore it. KH> I'm sorry if I offended anybody, but I love Quest and I'm sick of all the people complaining about things that are much worse in any other pbm game I know. I'm not saying that Quest is perfect, its just the best there is. Live with it or leave it| <* Kai Hortmann - University of Konstanz - Germany *> <* chbrin5@nyx.uni-konstanz.de *> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 2 Sep 92 14:42:12 GMT From: Dave Rees <chaos@thanes.demon.co.uk> DR> ALL Do you really think weather is going to improve the game play? DR> Shambler is 120gp/sector DR> All I'm considering joining another game other than 14. Anyone know which games are the most lively? I want to play a Good/Neutral group this time. Any info on the current alliances dominant in any game or a multigame alliance etc. DR> Whilst writing the above piece I had a thought, [rare granted:)] fu= rther to the idea of extra-dimensional planes brought up a few months back no= w. 1) Access to any plane via one gateway per plane per world. (Shouldn't be too difficult to include) 2) Travel granted by use of Staff of Plane Travel or similar. I.E. 'U 1= 99' (New item shouldn't prove too difficult either.) 3) Party and vortex must be at same location. (Not very complex at all) 4) Vortices are only one way. (Nay problem either) 5) Exit vortices to all games with warning saying which game, turn time and the fact that your group number may change, if there is enough space to add another group to the game. This does open up interesting possiblities with only the problem of gro= up number clashes in the same plane. The only way I could see a way around 20 it is to extend the group number to 7 digits I.E. 1141251 there by giving a larger amount of groups in any game. Turn rate would have to slowed or speeded depending on the world entered. Of course this would mean new spells to find : Protection from fire etc And further new items : Amulet of protection from fire etc. Locations of vorticies could be hidden in dungeons or libraries or even in the Advice shops. New bigger and harder monsters could be added just for the specific planes : Elemental Lord etc. Well there you go. As I said just a thought. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 13 May 1995 22:56:12 +0100 (BST) From: Chris Dickson <chris.dickson@keble.oxford.ac.uk> There were 41 voters in the poll. As such, I believe it is the largest poll done of this nature, and I hope that its results would carry significant weight in deciding the order in which you add new features to the game, and possibly suggest some features that you had not thought of adding. Each voter had 20 votes to distribute between 34 topics for Quest improvement, or more accurately, between 69 sub-topics. Some voters awarded slightly more or fewer than 20 votes, and 827 votes were cast in all. I will make available the votes themselves, or a list of voters, if you would like to see it. What people most want to see. This list shows all the sub-topics which received at least 10 votes. Obviously there is a strong feeling that these things would be good to be implemented in Quest. They are ordered in descending popularity; the topics at the start are the most popular one. By the side of each topic is a number, a "/" and a second number; the first represents the number of votes received and the second represents the number of voters, a factor that has been used to break ties between topics receiving the same number of votes. 1 (15a) Unique artifacts with special powers 40/26 2 ( 6a) Implementation of mage's prisms, robes etc. 32/24 3 ( 8a) Email turns at a lower cost (possibly returned via post) 31/18 4 ( 2a) Get rid of the ability to attack with very low flee factor 30/19 5 (31b) "Investigate All Items in a room in a dungeon" order 29/21 6 (26a) Can pay game cash into another party's bank account 28/10 7 ( 9a) Implementation of horses, mules, pegasi etc. 27/20 8 (13a) Implementation of new spells and miracles 26/19 9 (15b) New type of quest, to retrieve a special artifact 24/22 10 (34b) Minimum level of quality of parties - can't be destroyed 24/ 5 11 ( 1a) Failed thefts penalized by injury or imprisonment 22/17 12= (13c) Death spells consume many expensive powders, or skill points 21/14 12= (23a) Temple Quest difficulty and payoff related to party quality 21/14 14 (31a) Make dungeons more interesting 19/16 15 (30a) Mixed monster groups eg goblins and trolls 18/17 16 (23c) Nature of Temple Quest to be related to appropriate god 18/15 17 ( 7b) "Send message to other party" orders 16/12 18= ( 4h) Alliances set up wilderness HQs (castles, forts, towers) 15/12 18= ( 2c) Minimum flee factor related to general attitude 15/12 20 (16a) More classes of characters, eg paladins, bards 15/11 21 (10a) Male and female characters 15/10 22 (20a) New command: Follow Road 14/11 23= ( 4f) New quest type; kill member of enemy alliance 13/11 23= (15d) Artifacts to be carried around by mobile, tough monsters 13/11 23= (22a) New, more powerful monsters 13/11 26 ( 3b) Signposts in wilderness, giving directions to settlements 13/ 9 27 ( 3a) More NPCs in wilderness, giving directions to settlements 13 /8 28 ( 5a) Aligned cities 12/11 29 (13e) Separate spell rankings and ASLs for monster & player combat 12/10 30 (17a) Arenas in cities for willing parties to fight each other 11/10 31 ( 2b) 1 round melee in combat compulsory 11/ 9 32 ( 1b) Quests of the form "attack/kill specified thieving parties" 10/10 33 (27a) Characters act in combat in descending order of awareness 10/ 9 34= (14a) Extremely aligned parties cannot cast miracles of other gods 10/ 8 34= (15c) All parties told which parties obtain which artifacts 10/ 8 36 (21a) Shop list information obtainable in fewer turns 10/ 8 37 (32a) Players to add their own routines to Quest game code 10/ 5 What most people want to see. This list shows all the sub-topics which were voted for by at least 10 people. Obviously lots of people would like to see these features quickly implemented in Quest. They are ordered in descending popularity; the topics at the start are the most popular one. By the side of each topic is a number, a "/" and a second number; the first represents the number of voters and the second represents the number of votes received, a factor that has been used to break ties between topics receiving the same number of voters. 1 (15a) Unique artifacts with special powers 26/40 2 ( 6a) Implementation of mage's prisms, robes etc. 24/32 3 (15b) New type of quest, to retrieve a special artifact 22/24 4 (31b) "Investigate All Items in a room in a dungeon" order 21/29 5 ( 9a) Implementation of horses, mules, pegasi etc. 20/27 6 ( 2a) Get rid of the ability to attack with very low flee factor 19/30 7 (13a) Implementation of new spells and miracles 19/26 8 ( 8a) Email turns at a lower cost (possibly returned via post) 18/31 9 ( 1a) Failed thefts penalized by injury or imprisonment 17/22 10 (30a) Mixed monster groups eg goblins and trolls 17/18 11 (31a) Make dungeons more interesting 16/19 12 (23c) Nature of Temple Quest to be related to appropriate god 15/18 13= (13c) Death spells consume many expensive powders, or skill points 14/21 13= (23a) Temple Quest difficulty and payoff related to party quality 14/21 15 ( 7b) "Send message to other party" orders 12/16 16= ( 4h) Alliances set up wilderness HQs (castles, forts, towers) 12/15 16= ( 2c) Minimum flee factor related to general attitude 12/15 18 (16a) More classes of characters, eg paladins, bards 11/15 19 (20a) New command: Follow Road 11/14 20= ( 4f) New quest type; kill member of enemy alliance 11/13 20= (15d) Artifacts to be carried around by mobile, tough monsters 11/13 20= (22a) New, more powerful monsters 11/13 23 ( 5a) Aligned cities 11/12 24 (26a) Can pay game cash into another party's bank account 10/28 25 (10a) Male and female characters 10/15 26 (13e) Separate spell rankings and ASLs for monster & player combat 10/12 27 (17a) Arenas in cities for willing parties to fight each other 10/11 Summary. This chart ranks the overall topics, as opposed to the induvidual sub-topics, as to what people want most to see. Overall topics receiving 25 or more votes have been included. (The vote for topic 2 is defined to be the sum of the votes for sub-topics 2a, 2b and 2c, similarly for every other topic.) The figure on the right represents the number of votes. 1 (15) Introduction of artifacts into Quest 87 2 ( 4) Improvement to abilities of alliances 72 3 (13) Improved miracles and spells 71 4 ( 2) Change in fighting ability of 0% Flee Factor parties 56 5 (31) Improved dungeons 48 6 ( 6) Improvement to magic system as such 41 7 (23) Changes to Temple Quests 40 8 ( 7) Sending in-game messages to other parties 33 9 ( 1) Punishment for failed thefts 32 10 ( 8) Sending turns via e-mail 31 11 (26) Payment into other parties' bank accounts 28 12= (34) Parties cannot be destroyed completely 27 12= ( 9) Horses and beasts of burden 27 12= (30) Changes to composition and abilities of monster groups 27 15 ( 3) Easier to find settlements 26 For reference, here is a complete summary of the votes received by each of the sub-topics. 1a: 22/17. 1b: 10/10. 2a: 30/19. 2b: 11/9. 2c: 15/12. 3a: 13/8. 3b: 13/9. 4a: 6/6. 4b: 3/3. 4c: 9/7. 4d: 3/3. 4e: 1/1. 4f: 13/11. 4g: 4/4. 4h: 15/12. 4i: 4/4. 4j: 6/6. 4k: 8/7. 5a: 12/11. 5b: 4/4. 6a: 32/24. 6b: 9/9. 7a: 9/8. 7b: 16/12. 7c: 8/7. 8a: 31/18. 9a: 27/20. 10a: 15/10. 11a: 4/4. 12a: 5/5. 13a: 26/19. 13b: 7/6. 13c: 21/14. 13d: 5/5. 13e: 12/10. 14a: 10/8. 14b: 6/5. 15a: 40/26. 15b: 24/22. 15c: 10/8. 15d: 13/11. 16a: 15/11. 17a: 11/10. 18a: 7/7. 18b: 4/4. 19a: 8/8. 20a: 14/11. 21a: 10/6. 22a: 13/11. 23a: 21/14. 23b: 1/1. 23c: 18/15. 24a: 2/2. 25a: 5/4. 25b: 4/3. 25c: 1/1. 26a: 28/10. 27a: 10/9. 28a: 4/4. 29a: 4/4. 30a: 18/17. 30b: 9/9. 31a: 19/16. 31b: 29/21. 32a: 10/5. 33a: 2/2. 34a: 3/2. 34b: 24/5. These refer to the full list of topics on the voting form, available from me on request. (JPG> Taken from letter that will go to KJC) -------------------------------------------------------------------------- JPG> Well, happy questing folks! Back to the work for me.. :-( >>-Josh-> "Dreamer... Nothing but a dreamer..." Up