BSE Digest v195 #227 From: kerry@freeside.fc.net (Kerry Harrison) Date: Tue, 20 Jun 1995 00:00:00 +0000 BSE Digest Monday, 19 June 1995 Volume 195 : Number 227 Welcome to the BSE Digest, the place to discuss all the myriad aspects of life Beyond the Stellar Empire with other denizens of the Greater Periphery. In this issue: + Colony Turns + Re: BSE: Colony Turns + BSE:Proposed Changes + BSE- New players + Re: BSE: WCE & PortRude -Reply + Re: BSE: Revisionist! + GTT Profile, cont'd + Re: BSE:Proposed Changes + Re: BSE: Buying Fissionables + Re: BSE: Web Browsers + Re: BSE:Proposed Changes + Re: BSE: WCE & PortRude + IMP shooting IND + Re: BSE: WCE Charges Against He-whose-n + Re: #1(2) BSE Digest V195 #226 + Revenge of the Whale + Re: BSE: WCE & PortRude + Re: BSE: Revenge of the Whale + BSE: IMP shooting IND + Re: BSE: WCE Charges Against He-whose-n See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the bse-list or bse-digest mailing lists. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Hendrick,Bill;=9462771" <BHENDRICK@kean.ucs.mun.ca> Date: Sun, 18 Jun 1995 19:08:10 +0200 (IST) Subject: Colony Turns Chip Once again I will state that I am still a relatively new player and I don't know everything, but lets look at this research topic where I think your real concern is. The way I look a topic like research can really give GMs a lot of ulcers. I wasn't around when ABM was running the show but I have a feeling I am only hearing a fraction of the nonsense that players had to put up with. If RTG wants to run BSE in a hands off manner the only way they can do so is through rules. I can imagine that they spend a lot of time looking at every rule change to see if it gives one aff a significantly larger advantage over the rest. If they screw up they will be forced to 'pull a fat-boy'. Now back to research. Research is really just rule alterations. If research was too easy to do and everyone did it then things would become too unpredictable in my view. In my view hard research is one of the prices you pay for having a hands off GM. Bill ------------------------------ From: ac217@detroit.freenet.org (Chip Charnley) Date: Sun, 18 Jun 1995 17:54:27 -0400 Subject: Re: BSE: Colony Turns > > > >Chip > > >Once again I will state that I am still a relatively new player and I >don't know everything, but lets look at this research topic where I think >your real concern is. The way I look a topic like research can really >give GMs a lot of ulcers. I wasn't around when ABM was running the show >but I have a feeling I am only hearing a fraction of the nonsense that >players had to put up with. If RTG wants to run BSE in a hands off >manner the only way they can do so is through rules. I can imagine that >they spend a lot of time looking at every rule change to see if it gives >one aff a significantly larger advantage over the rest. If they screw up >they will be forced to 'pull a fat-boy'. Now back to research. Research >is really just rule alterations. If research was too easy to do and >everyone did it then things would become too unpredictable in my view. >In my view hard research is one of the prices you pay for having a hands >off GM. > > > Bill > > Bill, I don't mind HARD research within the game context. I DO mind ANY time hard is defined with US DOLLARS. If modifying things to make it reasonable for anyone that wants to to run a research colony means that research is now too easy, stiffen the in game controls (project class and points). Other than that, I agree with what you have said. ------------------------------ From: "Richard A. Loutzenheiser" <76311.2317@compuserve.com> Date: 18 Jun 95 19:22:04 EDT Subject: BSE:Proposed Changes RE: Chip's responses: On PF: You are right, we see the same outcome but interpret its long-term effects differently. I might be persauded to go for this for say class 3 and smaller colonies or maybe 4. I am I worried about someone who uses the longer PF to slowly takeover an affiliation as the other players leave (BTW I don't like the GM's running Aff colonies either). The concentration of several large colonies in one players hands is distrubing and is not good for the game. I also think that it would unfairly add to the RIP and KZK and other race's who can build hidden colonies. Maybe something could to modify their abilities in this manner. On Ship Turns: I know that this was the original reason for morale and morale decreases. (As an aside I was amazed when the Rec Deck was approved). You are correct in pointing out that loopholes in the rules regarding ships generally have more impact than ones regarding colonies. (That is why I am glad we don't have fleet turns anymore). I think that politically this idea is infeasible but that doesn't mean that it doesn't have merit. I run every one of my ships virtually every week, always have always will. The fact that some people will build ships like other expendible munitions and let them sit around the starport until some campaign is contrary to my roleplaying style. I would be in favour of your suggestion, or alternatively in some steeper morale declines accompanied by increase morale increases. That would force people to run ships more often without affecting the play of those of us who already do. RE: Jim Gagliardi's suggestion about discussing what is under revision: Excellent idea. I knew there was a reason I liked you. Having fought in a lot of ground and space battle (you do that when you were in the IMP) I have opinions about every part of the combat system and changes that should be made. My first comment will that the number of rounds of space battle should be increased and the damage done per round by weapon systems should be adjusted proportionally. Additionally I think that ship's should flee if there % damaged exceeds their morale. It is my belief that programming limitations were the reason for only 4 rounds of battle. With more rounds, the variations increase (ships flee, retarget, etc before blowing up as they would now) and the whole thing becomes more enjoyable. The way the system works now their is little room for chance (better space battle option choices, etc.) to effect the outcome. Results can be determined immediately after the initial checks see who is sticking around. With more rounds and morale checks the bigger fleet could lose if its programs are poor or its morale is. Anyone out there want to comment. ------------------------------ From: ASOCCIO@aol.com Date: Sun, 18 Jun 1995 21:17:13 -0400 Subject: BSE- New players I am a new player, and subscriber to bse-list. I have been reading for a week now. As I see it, the big thing to you all is the cost of the game. Here is a though. Why not work on getting more new players. If more people played the game it would be easer to get RTG to lower or change prices or make colony turn 12 weeks. As a new player, I would have to say, that after 4 year of all types of games I my enjoying every turn. BUT, if I wasn't a hard core game player I would have quit after the free turn. Why you say ???? Well to start, if I did not call the RTG BBS I would have no clue to what affiliations did. I would most likely have went IND and after turn two would have quit. So maybe some of you Political Positions should find who's new and get to recruiting for your affiliations. If it was not for the AFT Master Trader ,and Chief Journeyman, I would not be in the game they have spent time with me and have done what ever was needed to get me going in the BSE Star System. I am now a loyal AFT Starcaptain. I think that the future of BSE is in the new players they will bring new interaction and imagination to the game if they are recruited and helped befor they quit and take there money to another PBM game. Just a though from a new player that was saved, Tony Soccio ------------------------------ From: Kerry Harrison <kerry@freeside.fc.net> Date: Sun, 18 Jun 1995 21:38:57 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: BSE: WCE & PortRude -Reply On Fri, 16 Jun 1995 PKRAUSKOPF@falcon.al.wpafb.af.mil wrote: > BOTTOM LINE: Because of the timing of the situation, > you guys would've had to knock out the space ring > (since this is the tactic you were using), knock down > the ground ring significantly, and then capture the > colony in a mere two weeks, if everything had gone > without any screw-ups. To my knowledge, no major > colony has ever fallen this quickly. Two things: There's always stuff going on you don't know about. and There's always a first time. <G> Kerry ------------------------------ From: Kerry Harrison <kerry@freeside.fc.net> Date: Sun, 18 Jun 1995 21:49:10 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: BSE: Revisionist! On Thu, 15 Jun 1995, Wayne Alexander wrote: > I don't know how Sir Arthur Curry feels about it, but I can't say it > thrills me to hear that you are rewriting history, just because you > didn't like the way it turned out. Who the hell said I was rewriting history?! > If you claim its a fictional work of art in a "what-if" scenario, ok. > But, you can't rewrite history. There's just something wrong with > that. What I'm writing is an alternative (as in alternative universe) historical scenario in which the what-if turning point is humanity's first interstellar war. Kerry ------------------------------ From: wayne.alexander@mercopus.com (Wayne Alexander) Date: Sun, 18 Jun 95 13:28:00 -0500 Subject: GTT Profile, cont'd To Whom It May Concern, When the FOE invaded Jovian the Imperials realized it needed ships, lots of them, and it needed them quick. The Imperials approached the solution from two directions. 1. Obtain an immediate influx of big ships (DN). The GTT had plenty of hulls. Adm. Dax Krieger approached the GTT PD (Peter Henry) who was advised of our wishes and gladly allowed the confiscation of the GTT hull account to cover immediate IMP needs. The hulls confiscated were repaid to the GTT, in full, by 6-28-93 2. Obtain a long term source of hulls for big ships. The EEM PD was approached by a joint committee of Baron Von Krieger, Adm Dax Krieger, and Vice Admiral Seafeather. The EEM offered to provide ten DN at once, and ten DNs a month for the next year. In return, the IMP turned over Valka and mortgaged five other major IMP colonies. The hulls were provided, the ships were built, the colonies were mortgaged and the rest is history. FYI, the IMP debt to the EEM has been repaid in full as of Week 7/195. These are the facts as recorded in my game diaries. Wayne - --- . QMPro 1.53 . There's nothing like the personal touch of a hired goon. - ---- +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ | Mercury Opus BBS - St. Petersburg, Florida, USA - +1-813-321-0734 | | 2000 Conferences - 100,000 Files - One of America's Top 100 BBS Systems | +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+ ------------------------------ From: Kerry Harrison <kerry@freeside.fc.net> Date: Sun, 18 Jun 1995 22:25:25 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: BSE:Proposed Changes On 18 Jun 1995, Richard A. Loutzenheiser wrote: > I also think that it would unfairly add to the RIP and KZK and other race's who > can build hidden colonies. Maybe something could to modify their abilities in > this manner. I'll thank you to leave us out of your nefarious plots, Samillian <g>. Seriously, I really doubt that increasing the PF of colony printouts would greatly increase the number of colonies I run as I find about 30 positions (of any type) is about the maximum I have time to keep a handle on. The more I think about it, I think I would like to see colony turn fees reduced to about $3.00 per 30 orders. Kerry ------------------------------ From: Kerry Harrison <kerry@freeside.fc.net> Date: Sun, 18 Jun 1995 23:02:38 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: BSE: Buying Fissionables On Fri, 16 Jun 1995, Charles Meredith wrote: > Another option would be a varient on their standing order for > transfer. Just like the regular market buy and sell; but it refreshes each > weekly adjustment. I would suggest that it cap the actual quantity to sell > to what exists in the colony AFTER the production run. To make it easier to > run the colony, an option could also include an auto-production-order value > like such: > > Standing Buy: ZB (item#) (quantity) (buy price) > Standing Sell: ZS (item#) (quantity) (sell price) (Auto-Produce quantity) > > If the quantity of (item#) is not equal to or greater than > (quantity) and the (Auto-Produce quantity) is greater than zero, then a > Factory Production order in the quantity of (Auto-Produce quantity) will be > put into the production queue. > Now this would be quite useful, what'da say Thad can y'all add these orders to the game? Kerry ------------------------------ From: "Cap'n Scragg" <scragg@infi.net> Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 01:13:36 +0000 Subject: Re: BSE: Web Browsers >I'm curious to know which Web Browsers most of y'all use. The BSE pages >I've made where designed with NetScape in mind as I used several of their >HTML 3.0 Extensions, but should look decent under HTML 2.0 browsers also. >Kerry I'm using NETscape as well. I'll work on a RIP home page when I get this HTML thing figured out. Saturday I went to an Internet Publishing seminar. Estimates are that about 75% of the people using the WWW are now using NETScape. You may want to link the BSE hompage to someplace people can download Netscape. Joe ------------------------------ From: LUDENDORF@delphi.com Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 01:56:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: BSE:Proposed Changes > I also think that it would ufairly add to the RIP and KZK and other race's > who can build hidden something could to modify their abilities > in this manner. Rick L., while I can't say about the KZK 'cause I haven't seen their real profile, according to the RIP profile (special ability #15) if a RIP colony exceeds class 5, it losses it's special "cloaked" status. Fat-boy once described it to me as a sort of sensor scrambler (he tried the underground bit, till I said okay, I bring in an ITS SH loaded with TB's and pull the dirt away, exposing the colony). And if it grew beyond class 5, it had exceeded the capacity of the generators to cloak. Steve ------------------------------ From: StephMarte@aol.com Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 02:01:13 -0400 Subject: Re: BSE: WCE & PortRude >Q: How can you tell the puppet "T3" is composed of elder races? >A: All they do is sit and gab. >Har, har... Mr. Vodqyn, For someone that insults the WCE, SAM, and FGZ for being long on words and short on action I've yet to see the QSN coordinate a single successful military action against a live opponent. Meanwhile the WCE has destroyed two of your personal SoL's, captured the QSN Lian-Chaa, and destroyed one of Minister Qutroh's vessels. The joke's on you. Sir Arthur Curry WCE Secretary For War ------------------------------ From: EdRees@aol.com Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 10:16:26 -0400 Subject: IMP shooting IND > (From: LUDENDORF@delphi.com > Anyways, the IMP has basically been >shooting at IND for years. Until RTG took over, IND was just another >word for RIP. This is just the first time that a colony as public as Samms >will start shooting outside of the starport. > >Steve Hmmm. Don't you think this is grossly unfair to new players? This basically means that a new player MUST join an Aff in the beginning, and pretty much removes the option of running an IND position to get the "feel" of the game, and give some time to interact with the other groups to determine which may be a good fit for ultimately selecting an Aff. If you look over the descriptions of the Affs in the rules, do you really think any good new player, dedicated to role-play, would select his/her several-year future play in the game based upno a paragraph description? Especially as the descriptions in the rules are skimpy on the inter-aff relationships, and can't hope to keep up on the current political jockeying? Deciding to shoot at all IND ships because you expect them to be pirates is a bit bull-headed, and seems to indicate you'd rather pick on IND than spend some time chasing RIP, no? Perhaps you should consider witch-burning as a hobby. "If she floats, she's a witch..." Sorry if I raise your ire, but I would like to run a clean position to "test the waters" a bit, and am not particularly interested in running an imperial position, as that also holds connotations with which I'm not comfortable. TRN is only available for the first 3 turns, which is certainly not long enough to get an adequate picture. Ed ------------------------------ From: rboggs@isisph.com (Russ Boggs) Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 08:50:56 -0700 Subject: Re: BSE: WCE Charges Against He-whose-n MacBeth scratches his head, and tries to remember that Bad Old Days. Well, let's see now. If I were still in the WCE, I'd certainly bring to the court's attention two incidents. #1: The court should not need to be reminded that Fat-Boy originally placed their homeworld in the middle of the Vertex system in imminent danger of being destroyed. Were it not for the timely intervention of the WCE (under my leadership), this whole planet might be a charred cinder. #2: Let us not forget the wanton destruction of the planet Daloe in the Portcia system. How many thousands of lives were lost when the Fat-Boy and his cohorts kicked that planet into the Portcia blackhole? - --Russ Boggs for MacBeth ------------------------------ From: RTGames@aol.com Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 12:20:17 -0400 Subject: Re: #1(2) BSE Digest V195 #226 Steve- See the rules, Chapter 5, page 21, "Derelicts". "At the conclusion of a battle, any ships incapable of firing and moving, or which have insufficent crew in Command and/or Cargo to operate their ship, are considered Derelict." So, what's the question? Thad ------------------------------ From: ronk@triassic-142.Eng.Sun.COM (Ron Kleinman) Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 11:20:48 -0700 Subject: Revenge of the Whale Gentlepersons, Since the Blue Whale was attacked by drug-crazed RIP pirate scum last month ... 1. Lord Hairy Flashpan of WCE Wirth was declared insane, and sent to a funny farm in the inner empire. Wirth returned to its independent status. 2. The Prothyroid thing has apparently buzzed off, taking many of the other Wasps with him. 3. Now word comes that the FGZ's Attaboy "has begun limiting his availablity to many outside of the THC and FGZ". This appears to take care of the three main suspects behind the Blue Whale attack. Let that be a lesson to Sir Arthur Curdy and others who would harm defenseless QSN merchant vessels! Respectfully, Nicholas Van Rijn MerchantPerson QSN Blue Whale ------------------------------ From: Richard William Chiang <richc@uclink2.berkeley.edu> Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 11:32:13 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Re: BSE: WCE & PortRude On Mon, 19 Jun 1995 StephMarte@aol.com wrote: > For someone that insults the WCE, SAM, and FGZ for > being long on words and short on action I've yet to see the > QSN coordinate a single successful military action against a > live opponent. Meanwhile the WCE has destroyed two of your > personal SoL's, captured the QSN Lian-Chaa, and destroyed > one of Minister Qutroh's vessels. > The joke's on you. > > Sir Arthur Curry > WCE Secretary For War Sir Curry, None of my vessels have been destroyed. If you refer to the Merchantman you destroyed, it was tasked to others. As for your comments, it is called restraint. When the QSN decides that force is necessary, then it will come fast and hard. It is a fate I would like to avoid, but it seems less and less likely. How quickly you forget the liberation of Eldorath which at the time was the largest WCE production colony. Lord Qutroh Minister of Propaganda ------------------------------ From: "Cap'n Scragg" <scragg@infi.net> Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 18:57:25 +0000 Subject: Re: BSE: Revenge of the Whale > Since the Blue Whale was attacked by drug-crazed RIP pirate scum last >month ... <snip> ahh Cap'n Nick. Nice to hear from you again. Finally got that target barge you call the Blue Whale out of the shop eeh? Cap'n Scragg ------------------------------ From: philip.breault@com2bbs.com (Philip Breault) Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 17:09:00 -0800 Subject: BSE: IMP shooting IND Ed, It's basically recommended that a newbie start off in an affiliation. Unless you know a lot of people in BSE, it's going to be real frustrating if you start off IND; people just aren't going to trust you, and you're going to spend a lot of time trying to dig up information that most affiliations already have. As for Steve targeting IND ships- that's his perogative. IND ships lately have been used as terrorist platforms, and not necessarily by the RIP. Besides the IMPies, the EEM, AFT and GTT have all been attacked by IND positions. I would highly recommend that you play for a few weeks and observe goings-on in the List and Digest before making comments of the sort that you did. Then you wouldn't sound so silly. Philip Breault (BSE for 12+ years) \\\|/// -(o o)- +------------------------oOOOo--(_)--oOOOo----------------------------+ | COM2: BBS | sysop: Sean Azhadi | | San Diego, CA. | Internet: sysop@com2bbs.com | | 619.737.0495 BBS 12 Nodes | Info: info@com2bbs.com | | 619.737.9659 voice | | +---------------------------+-----------------------------------------+ The contents of this message do not necessarily reflect the opinions of this BBS, it's operators or sponsors... But they should. ------------------------------ From: LUDENDORF@delphi.com Date: Mon, 19 Jun 1995 21:26:10 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: BSE: WCE Charges Against He-whose-n > #2: Let us not forget the wanton destruction of the planet Daloe in the > Portcia system. How many thousands of lives were lost when the Fat-Boy and > his cohorts kicked that planet into the Portcia blackhole? Russ, thanks.... I completely forgot about that. Steve Wayne, consider Daloe added to the IMP list, specificly the wanton destruction of the ISS colony Journey's End on Daloe. Steve ------------------------------ End of BSE Digest V195 #227 *************************** BSE Digest - All items Copyright (c) 1995, by their respective authors, permission is granted to redistribute as long as proper credit is given. To subscribe to BSE Digest, send the command: + subscribe bse-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@fc.net". 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