ATLANTISv2 atl-design-digest #40

From: csd@microplex.com (Christian Daudt)

Date: Wed, 02 Aug 1995 00:00:00 +0000

This is kept by me (csd@microplex.com)
If there are any problems, please tell me 'cause I normally
don't have enough time to read them.
If you want previous versions, they are available via WWW at
http://www.microplex.com/~csd/atlantisv2/
----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 1995 17:08:50 -0500 (CDT)
From: Lazarus <llong@io.com>
Subject: Re: Notes from a newbie (long)

Yes, War is the way to go now.

There is not enough room for everybody to be pure war factions
as the game now stands.

Hopefully, in the newer versions, it will be more fun to be something
else besides just war.

At the very least, going around the hex collecting taxes should
be a month long order. Our IRS tax collecters work full time at their
job, the guards should have to devote the whole month to collect
taxes also.
(Think of the armbending, head bashing, and bookkeeping involved
in getting taxes from everyone.)

On Fri, 28 Jul 1995, D.J. McGaw wrote:

> > Overall, Atlantis 2.0 is pretty well designed.  However, it seems to have a
> > strong built in bias towards war factions.
> >
>
> Yep - it seems war is the way to go!
>
> > 1) Why are  factions allowed to have units TAX + GUARD + WORK all in the
> same
> > turn? Trade factions really lose out here- they need seperate people to
> guard a
> > hex, plus they can't get work income.  Alternately, the unit can study
> during
> > the month, thus allowing a much less costly advance to <skill> 3 than a
> trade
> > faction.  I like the idea in Atlantis 1.0 to have production count towards
> > skill increase.
>
> Guard is simply a flag and not an order, but Tax+Work is a good point.
> Although Tax is easily collected (like a milkman's round) the Trade factions should
> be given a similar method of generating simple revenue without resorting to
> buying and selling constantly for maintenance.
>
> (Like a Bargaining skill that allows for Haggling/Bartering in regions to
> generate income similar to Tax.)
>
> >
> > 2) The jump from 5-100 hexes for mixed faction- pure war is far too high.
>  You
> > almost have to specialize to have a chance.  The scaled system given in
> > previous comments would work much better.
>
> I totally agree (even though it was myself, Geoff and Vince who managed to
> getnoticed on this point).
>
> >
> > 3) GUARDing a hex is too easy.  Switching to a system where you have to
> define
> > what you're guarding (Production, tax, hexside), would work much better.  In
> > addition, guarding something should be a full turn order, with bonuses to
> COM
> > skill in the same fashion as production gives to trade skills.
>
> No, this is where I lose you. Guarding units are protecting the WHOLE region,
> especially from pillaging, but also from neutral/unfriendly/hostile units
> taxing.
> Guarding, as mentioned, is just a flag and should be kept as such. It is
> basically a region safeguard, and a blocking tactic.
>
> I put forward another note on guarding restrictions, so look at that as well
> please and mail me your comments.
>
> >
> > 4) As someone who started late, I've had a lot of trouble finding a spot not
> > already claimed by either a huge war faction or 10,000 other screaming
> newbies.
> > Perhaps leave an exit in Atlantis City that drops you in a random place
> _every
> > time it's used_, in addition to the standard exits.  This would allow
> newbies
> > to potentially find a home quickly, while not allowing the huge war
> factionsto
> > drive killer forces through all the time.  (You could take a big combat
> unit,
> > but not any mages with it.)  The only disadvantage is that your allies
> couldn't
> > join you.
> >
>
> The rotating exits is a better system, but should have really be thrown into
> the play at month 8 year 1 of game time. This allows the starting factions to
> form alliances, while the newbies get to move out and set up themselves.
>
> If it is random spitting out you want, try the Shadow Jump spell.
>
> > 5) A SCOUT unit would also be helpful.  Scout training would allow higher
> > movement, plus the ability to pass through guarded hexes.  (Corresponding to
> > the lvl.  I.e., SCOUT 1 allows passage through Unfriendly areas, SCT 2
> allows
> > Hostile passage.)  In addition, they would give terrain/economic data on
> every
> > hex they passed through.  Upkeep costs would be zero. (They live off the
> land)
> > They would not have the ability to tax, steal, or assassinate, nor have any
> > combat power.  This would allow newbies to find decent areas with fewer
> > problems, while not causing the problems that many people (Rightfully) have
> > with high stealth units.
>
> This is an interesting point, but with a decent system already in place, ie
> Stealth vs Obs, then this is not really a valid idea. Scouting is done by High
> lv Stealth units, who can steal to keep maintenance. Units not visible cannot
> be attacked (per se) so they can avoid passage difficulties.
>
> The terain and economy idea is a long one that's been going on since the
> firstmovements of the game, "If I pass through a jungle, surely I'd notice" idea.
>
> Take this up with Geoff again. I'm behind you on this point.
>
> As for the SCOUT skill? Try high obs and stealth combo.
>
> >
> > 6) As a role playing thing, add quests to the mix.  There could be several
> > temples strewn across Atlantis, which will grant a quest if asked.  Possible
> > quests would have to differ based on faction type, but could include killing
> > some horrible monster, building some very difficult item with hard to find
> > components, or casting some very difficult spell.  Successful completion
> could
> > result in a large cash award, several hexes agreeing to join your empire and
> > providing trained troops, or some very powerful magic item.  Have the
> > completion of a quest be announced with great fanfare in the Times.
>  (Probably
> > should place at least one temple in AC, so everyone can get at least one
> > quest.)
> >
>
> Interesting point, but wouldn't it comlicate the game a tad. World Conquest
> isa big enough task as it is!
>
> > 7) A SUPPLY order would be nice.  This order executes every turn until
> turned
> > off.  A producing unit can transfer people/money/resources to another unit
> > automatically.  This will make order writing for large trade factions much
> > easier.
>
> Yes it would, but wouldn't you lose tabs on the goods, and who is getting
> what? A simple solution is a personal orders template (not the one at the end of
> the report, but) one that has all the details and orders on it, that you
> simplyamend before you send.
>
> That is what I do, and a few other people here ate Liverpool do the same. Use
> comment lines to distinguish what it is you are doing to add clarity.
>
> >
> > 8) Ability to build towns/cities would also be nice.  This should obviously
> be
> > _very_ expensive in both people and resources, but once built, could pay off
> > handsomely.  Allow a portion of the money spent in the town (recruitment,
> > buy/sell commodity) to flow into a player's unclaimed money pile.  The
> player
> > that creates a town is responsible to pay for the guards, and towns can be
> > captured just as with any other unit.  Perhaps each town built should cost a
> > point from the War/Trade/Magic faction points?
> >
>
> Interesting concept. Bring it up with more detail at a later date.
>
> > 9) Allow the building of roads as well.  A road would double movement and
> allow
> > easy passage through difficult terrain.
>
> Roads have been discussed and thrown out. As with a lot of ideas, make a
> solidclear point and let the designers peruse your suggestions.
>
> >
> > Ok, hope I haven't rambled too long.  Any comments?
> >
>
> Not yet, and here's my two-penneth!
>
> Regards
>
> Dave
>
----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 1995 17:16:51 -0500 (CDT)
From: Lazarus <llong@io.com>
Subject: Re: Notes from a newbie (long)

Your ideas and opinions are just as good as ours!

Get into it with us.

Only Geoff will decide what is the way to do it, we simply try
to hash it out and see what might be right or wrong with each
option desired/unwanted for the game.

On Fri, 28 Jul 1995 Eric_Remy.XRCC@xerox.com wrote:

> I apologize for the bad quoting used here- my mailer is braindead.
>
> RE: Guarding.  We fundamentally disagree here.  Guarding to me is not "Just a
> flag".  To actively prevent people from entering/taxing/stealing production
> from  a huge area like a hex is going to take a lot of people running constant
> patrols.  You can't just put up stickers that say "This hex guarded by Ricky's
> Rangers, go away!" and then go back to the town to study swordmanship.
> However, since there seems to be an active debate on the nature of guarding
> going on among people who have played longer than I, I'll defer any further
> comments.
>
> Re: Random exit point.  You write:
> The rotating exits is a better system, but should have really be thrown into
> the play at month 8 year 1 of game time. This allows the starting factions to
> form alliances, while the newbies get to move out and set up themselves.
>
> If it is random spitting out you want, try the Shadow Jump spell.
>
> I reply>  I'm not so sure I agree.
> Rotating exits drops you off with many other people all competing for space.
> Witness Cremona for an example of how disasterous this can be.  Dropping me
> somewhere random means I at least have a chance to claim a hex or two without
> being immediatly attacked by everyone just for the act of placing a claim on
> it.
>
>   Having no mages, I can't use the Shadow Jump.  (Since I know nothing of the
> magic system when I join, I don't even know of it's existance.)  Assuming I
> join up with other newbies, I probably won't know about it.  (Many of the magic
> factions object to giving out spell info, rightfully so IMHO.)
>
> Re: Scout unit.  You write>This is an interesting point, but with a decent
> system already in place, ie Stealth vs Obs, then this is not really a valid
> idea. Scouting is done by High
> lv Stealth units, who can steal to keep maintenance. Units not visible cannot
> be attacked (per se) so they can avoid passage difficulties.
>
> I reply>  But high Stealth units are disliked for obvious reasons.   Training a
> unit to Stealth lvl3+ means that it's stuck in AC for a long time- as a newbie,
> I need to find a home quickly, since I'm falling further behind every turn.  A
> scout is both cheap and harmless.
>
> Re: Quests.  Sure they'd complicate the game.  That's a good thing!  Some
> people are less interesting in owning the world.  (Personally, I'm trying to
> get the funds to open a college.)  This will give people who may not care about
> military conquest a difficult goal to reach, plus increase the role playing
> aspect.  If you're more interested in the wargame aspect, both bother.
>
> Thanks for the comments.
>
> Eric
>
> CEO BoB (tm), G.O.O.D. Ltd.
>
----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Fri, 28 Jul 1995 17:26:52 -0500 (CDT)
From: Lazarus <llong@io.com>
Subject: Re: Notes from a newbie (long)

This is a good idea.

The problem comes when Newbies are stuck in the cities and cannot get
anywhere because of all the guards.

They can strike out to new lands on their own.
They can have their allies join them.
We do not need a random exit or changing exit if newbies can
eventually get somewhere.

And, if the exit cities cannot be taken, then the War factions will
probably leave to go find ones that can be taken.
This gives some trade around the exit cities to develope.

I hope that there are high prices some where to let the chance for
profits to be made to move goods long distances.

War can get silver everywhere, but trade can barely stay alive.
They cannot even really get started without a war to support them.

On Fri, 28 Jul 1995, GDUNBAR.US.ORACLE.COM wrote:

>
> --Boundary-11825879-0-0
>
> I don't like the 'random exits' thing, because it eliminates
> any concept of a frontier. If new factions can be put any
> where, there is no unexplored territory that you can move
> out into.
>
> My plan for Atlantis 3 is to have 6 fixed exit cities, all
> coastal, and all sell infinite wood (and maybe some other
> stuff). So, new factions can easily build a boat and sail
> away.
>
> Geoff
>
>
>
> --Boundary-11825879-0-0
> X-Orcl-Content-Type: message/rfc822
>
> Received: 28 Jul 1995 10:55:43                    Sent: 28 Jul 1995 10:55:25
> From:"Michael W. Lamb" <owner-atl-design@tango.rahul.net>
> To: atl-design@tango.rahul.net
> Subject: Re: Notes from a newbie (long)
> Reply-to: owner-atl-design@tango.rahul.net
> X-Orcl-Application: Organization:  Brigham Young University
> X-Orcl-Application: X-Mailer:  Pegasus Mail v3.22
> X-Orcl-Application: Content-Transfer-Encoding:  7BIT
> X-Orcl-Application: Priority:  normal
>
>
> An even briefer comment on the random dispersal gate, which I believe
> I was one of the first to suggest/endorse.
>
> The whole purpose of a "Shadow Gate" as I called it, was to offer
> random dispersal to ALL new factions, not just ones that wanted to
> commit themselves and their resources to become Magic or
> Hybrid/Magic factions.  An earlier comment on this list was equally
> correct:  NEW FACTIONS ARE NOT NECESSARILY AWARE OF THE SHADOW JUMP
> OPTION!  Why should they be forced to study magic in order to have a
> chance at a decent location in the game?
>
>
> The Phoenix Emperor
> An Apotheosis in Progress
>
>
> --Boundary-11825879-0-0--
>
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Date: Fri, 28 Jul 1995 20:27:46 -0700
From: bonder@earthlink.net (Bruce Onder)
Subject: Re: Notes from a newbie (long)

At 1:26 PM 7/28/95, ROB PETERS wrote:
>A brief comment on the question of whether rotating gates to disperse
>people randomly is necessary.  The current shadow jump gives someone
>the option of random dispersal -- as a beginning generic faction
>it takes 3 turns to train a mage in the necessary foundations &
>research, then jump, claim your silver, & set up shop.

Sure, but why not just let people buy shadow jump spells in AC?  Then they
could do either -- waste time or money.

Bruce Onder                      | We write and design computer games.
Digital Arcana                   | Ask about our interactive underpants.
310.519.5993                     |
310.837.8533 fax                 | Or don't.

----------------------------------------------------------
From: "Jiri Klouda" <KLOUDA@novell.karlin.mff.cuni.cz>
Date:          Sat, 29 Jul 1995 10:04:12
Subject:       Re: Shadow exits

->At 1:26 PM 7/28/95, ROB PETERS wrote:
->>A brief comment on the question of whether rotating gates to disperse
->>people randomly is necessary.  The current shadow jump gives someone
->>the option of random dispersal -- as a beginning generic faction
->>it takes 3 turns to train a mage in the necessary foundations &
->>research, then jump, claim your silver, & set up shop.
->
->Sure, but why not just let people buy shadow jump spells in AC?  Then they
->could do either -- waste time or money.
->
And what about a magical item (ETH 2/CON 2 maybe or how it will be
in new foundations) that allows shadow jump spell for non-mage unit.
(For only one use or so...)
 Jirka
* Origin: Don't panic - virus will formatted Your HD only.
Jiri Klouda - Student of Faculty of Maths at Charles University
E-mail: klouda@novell.karlin.mff.cuni.cz
----------------------------------------------------------
From: Geoff Dunbar <atlantis@rahul.net>
Subject: Atlantis 2.0: atl-design list
Date: Mon, 31 Jul 95 22:03:52 -0700

This is a weekly posting for the atl-design mailing list. This list
is meant for anyone interested in the rules and design of Atlantis
2.0. The moderator of the Atlantis 2.0 game is on this list, so your
ideas could actually become reality! To send a message to everyone
on the list, send email to:

atl-design@tango.rahul.net

To subscribe or un-subscribe to this list, mail to
atlantis@rahul.net. Make sure you specify exactly what you want me
to do, because a lot of mail goes to this address.
----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 2 Aug 95 09:58:51 PDT
From: "GDUNBAR.US.ORACLE.COM" <GDUNBAR@us.oracle.com>
Subject: Re: Finding owners of units

--Boundary-11921071-0-0

]> The proper solution would be the a "message" command (like Galaxy uses).
]
]You are right, that it the proper way to send a message, and doing it
]this way will also allow you to send to structure (Like a tower, or a boat)
]
]The reason I have been shying from this is
]1) The Great God Geoff (GGG) stated that he did not have the resources to
]search the databace in that fashion (At least that is what I understood)

I'm now replying to this _only_ on the design list, because that's
where it belongs.

I could pretty easily add a message order, that would allow you
to send messages when the turn was run, that would appear on the
next month's report.

What I can't do, at present, is set up a message forwarding service
that sends the message right away. When I start a commercial
game, I will be able to put my machine on the net full time, and
this will be more of an option.

As it is right now, if you really want to talk to units that enter
your territory, just use a unit description demanding that they
email you (with your address). If they don't, treat them
appropriately.

Geoff

--Boundary-11921071-0-0
X-Orcl-Content-Type: message/rfc822

Received: 02 Aug 1995 09:50:45                    Sent: 02 Aug 1995 09:50:21
From:"Jeff Heinen " <owner-atl-design@tango.rahul.net>
To: hayden@krypton.mankato.msus.edu
Subject: Re: Finding owners of units
Cc: Atlantis,Design,List,atl-design@tango.rahul.net,Geoff,Dunbar,atlantis@rahul.net,ROB,PETERS,RPeters@Defender.Defenders.org,atl-players@ee.pdx.edu
Reply-to: owner-atl-design@tango.rahul.net
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X-Orcl-Application: Content-Type:  TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

On Wed, 2 Aug 1995, Robert A. Hayden wrote:

> The proper solution would be the a "message" command (like Galaxy uses).

You are right, that it the proper way to send a message, and doing it
this way will also allow you to send to structure (Like a tower, or a boat)

The reason I have been shying from this is
1) The Great God Geoff (GGG) stated that he did not have the resources to
search the databace in that fashion (At least that is what I understood)

2) From what I undersoot to its use, a quicker turn around was nessasary.
You see some one on a turn sheet and you want to tell them not to attack
you next turn. Or some such.

3) Do we really need ANOTHER thing on the turn sheets, Im having trouble
enough keep track of my faction commands, and Im still small.

-Jeff

-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-
               _       __  __   _   _      _
              | | ___ / _|/ _| | | | | ___(_)_ __   ___ _ __
           _  | |/ _ \ |_| |_  | |_| |/ _ \ | '_ \ / _ \ '_ \
          | |_| |  __/  _|  _| |  _  |  __/ | | | |  __/ | | |
           \___/ \___|_| |_|   |_| |_|\___|_|_| |_|\___|_| |_|
                                        	 jeffh@ee.pdx.edu
-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-=+=-

--Boundary-11921071-0-0--
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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 13:10:12 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@krypton.mankato.msus.edu>
Subject: Re: Finding owners of units

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On Wed, 2 Aug 1995, GDUNBAR.US.ORACLE.COM wrote:

> I could pretty easily add a message order, that would allow you
> to send messages when the turn was run, that would appear on the
> next month's report.

Ok, since you can do it, I'd like to try to clarify what I was thinking.

NEW COMMAND:  MESSAGE
Usage:
	MESSAGE FACTION ###
	MESSAGE UNIT ###
	MESSAGE BUILDING ###
	MESSAGE SHIP ###
	MESSAGE HEX

Orders a unit to send a MESSAGE to the owner of the designated unit.  A
message to a FACTION can be sent by any unit regardless of location.
However, if you do not know the faction number, you must address the
message to a UNIT, BUILDING, or SHIP, and the unit you order to send
the message must be in the same hex as the thing you are addressing.  The
message will go to the owner of the object you are addressing

In addition, you can send a message to all factions in the same hex as
the unit issuing the message with the MESSAGE HEX command.

When you issue the MESSAGE command, all text after the MESSAGE command
will considered to be the text of the message until a line beginning with
"MESSAGE END" is encountered.  Make sure to end your message or your
subsequent orders will appear on the target's turn report and you could
feel silly.

EXAMPLE:

UNIT 666

MESSAGE HEX
Everyone get out of my hex or my minions will make you leave!
MESSAGE END

MESSAGE FACTION 667
You are dubbed the Neighbor of the Beast. You must help me to defend my
realm.  Get your units to my hex and we'll do war.
MESSAGE END

=========================================================================

HOW THEY APPEAR ON YOUR REPORT

Key:	### 	Number sender designates in the command
	XXX 	Sender's Faction Number
	YY,ZZ	Hex Coordinates (AC is -,-)

MESSAGE FACTION ###:
MESSAGE FROM FACTION XXX (Faction Name)

MESSAGE UNIT ###:
MESSAGE FROM FACTION XXX (Faction Name) TO UNIT ### (Unit Name)

MESSAGE BUILDING ###:
MESSAGE FROM FACTION XXX (Faction Name) TO BUILDING ### (Building Name)

MESSAGE SHIP ###:
MESSAGE FROM FACTION XXX (Faction Name) TO SHIP ### (Ship Name)

MESSAGE HEX:
MESSAGE FROM FACTION XXX (Faction Name) TO HEX YY,ZZ

Any thoughts?

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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 11:33:23 -0700
From: bonder@earthlink.net (Bruce Onder)
Subject: Orders template

Geoff,

What would really, really help me in the orders template is a listing of
SIL in each
unit's comment.

Actually, if you could recapitulate the unit description in the turn
report, that would be mondo and I would regale you as a god unto men until
my skull caved in from sheer exhaustion.

Or for an hour! :)

----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 15:55:33 -0400
From: lam@diamond.eng.tridom.com (Larry Morris)
Subject: Re: Finding owners of units

>
> Maybe a "POST" command to stake signs in your region.  You could say
> something like
>
> UNIT 9999
>         POST "Hear ye, all units must pay 5 SIL per turn to Tax Collector
> Joe or suffer the wrath of the Dragon Horde..."

Hmmm. How about trying:
UNIT 9999
  FORM 1
     NAME UNIT "Signpost"
     DESCRIBE UNIT "Hear ye, all units..."
     BUY 1 plainsman
     work
  END

Ok, I know, why have a plainsman holding up your sign? Well, hey, you
could consider he's just guarding it from vandalism. Besides which, if
you can't afford the plainsman, you probably shouldn't be posting this
sort of sign ;-)

Related note, however: it would be fun to allow player factions to change
the name of regions, cities, etc. to other (unique) names, if they "control"
the region (perhaps based on exclusive occupation or some percentage of total
troops).

Crimson Robes (60)
lam@eng.tridom.com
----------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Orders template
Date: Wed, 02 Aug 1995 13:15:51 -0700
From: Anson Winsor <apwinsor@lonnie-mack.CS.UNLV.EDU>

This is a VERY good idea. I like the template and I use it to help
keep down typing errors but I still go through the report and
delete all the other information to get my unit information in
one place so I can look at it when I do my turn report.

I would like the template with the same information about my units
as the turn report currently has.

I don't even mind if the ';' are put infront of the comments as
I can do that.

It would make the turn so much easier. I wouldn't have to spend the
time to delete all other information.

Anson

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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 11:33:23 -0700
To: atl-design@tango.rahul.net
From: Bruce Onder <bonder@earthlink.net>
Subject: Orders template

Geoff,

What would really, really help me in the orders template is a listing of
SIL in each
unit's comment.

Actually, if you could recapitulate the unit description in the turn
report, that would be mondo and I would regale you as a god unto men until
my skull caved in from sheer exhaustion.

Or for an hour! :)

------- End of Forwarded Message

----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 16:14:40 -0500 (CDT)
From: Lazarus <llong@io.com>
Subject: Re: Orders template

This unit description on the turn template is a good idea.
It would save me a lot of time searching out the report each
time I want to decide what my units can do and what I want
them to do and help plan what they need to be able to do.

On Wed, 2 Aug 1995, Anson Winsor wrote:

> This is a VERY good idea. I like the template and I use it to help
> keep down typing errors but I still go through the report and
> delete all the other information to get my unit information in
> one place so I can look at it when I do my turn report.
>
> I would like the template with the same information about my units
> as the turn report currently has.
>
> I don't even mind if the ';' are put infront of the comments as
> I can do that.
>
> It would make the turn so much easier. I wouldn't have to spend the
> time to delete all other information.
>
> Anson
>
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>
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>           2 Aug 95 12:08 PDT
> Received: by tango.rahul.net id AA27381
>   (5.67b8/IDA-1.5 for real-atl-design); Wed, 2 Aug 1995 11:31:05 -0700
> Received: from atlas.earthlink.net by tango.rahul.net with SMTP id AA27371
>   (5.67b8/IDA-1.5 for <atl-design@tango.rahul.net>); Wed, 2 Aug 1995 11:31:01 -0700
> Received: from [198.68.161.47] (bonder.earthlink.net [198.68.161.47]) by atlas.earthlink.net (8.6.11/8.6.12) with SMTP id LAA17692 for <atl-design@tango.rahul.net>; Wed, 2 Aug 1995 11:36:07 -0700
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> Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 11:33:23 -0700
> To: atl-design@tango.rahul.net
> From: Bruce Onder <bonder@earthlink.net>
> Subject: Orders template
>
> Geoff,
>
> What would really, really help me in the orders template is a listing of
> SIL in each
> unit's comment.
>
> Actually, if you could recapitulate the unit description in the turn
> report, that would be mondo and I would regale you as a god unto men until
> my skull caved in from sheer exhaustion.
>
> Or for an hour! :)
>
> Bruce Onder                      | We write and design computer games.
> Digital Arcana                   | Ask about our interactive underpants.
> 310.519.5993                     |
> 310.837.8533 fax                 | Or don't.
>
>
>
> ------- End of Forwarded Message
>
>
----------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 16:12:59 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@krypton.mankato.msus.edu>
Subject: Re: Orders template

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Here's what I'd kinda like to see on the template.  I'll pull one or two
of my UNITs out for the example.  The first is the example as it appears
on my turn report.  The second is what I'd like to see in the template.

TURN REPORT:
Atlantis City (-,-), city, 1178 peasants (high elves), $5890.
- ------------------------------------------------------------
[...]
+ Grandma and Grandpa's House [3] : Tower, needs 7.
  * Grandpa MacCryre (6121), Clan MacCryre (895), avoiding, behind, 40
    silver, high elf, 3 stone. Skills: building 1 (30); Building a
    Home.
  * Grandma MacCryre (6120), Clan MacCryre (895), avoiding, behind, 55
    silver, high elf, 4 stone. Skills: building 1 (30); Building a
    Home.

===========================
TEMPLATE

unit 6121
; Grandpa MacCryre (6121) in Atlantis City (-,-)
; avoiding, behind, 40 silver, high elf, 3 stone. Skills: building 1 (30);
; Building a Home.
BUILD

unit 6120
; Grandma MacCryre (6120) in Atlantis City (-,-)
; avoiding, behind, 55 silver, high elf, 4 stone. Skills: building 1 (30);
; Building a Home.
BUILD

=========================================
COMMENTARY

Basicly, if the template included as much information as possible, it
would be much more useful.  It saves referencing back tot he turn report
and such, and allows concentration on just your units and such.  Since
the information is pulled out for the making of the report, I'd think it
would be fairly simple for it to be duplicated in the report.

Just some thoughts :-)

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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 16:32:21 -0500 (CDT)
From: "Robert A. Hayden" <hayden@krypton.mankato.msus.edu>
Subject: Another Turn Report Request

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Me again . . . I have another request for something to be added to turn
reports.

I know that there is the RESHOW command, but is there any chance that we
can get the turn reports to always show the information on the skills and
spells you possess.

Or, failing that (could get repetitive and lengthy now that I think about
it), how about a "RESHOW ALL" option that will list ALL of the Spells and
Skills you possess.  Saves having to poke through the report to determine
whcih levels of what you need to request.

Thanks :-)

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Date: Wed, 2 Aug 1995 16:31:05 -0500
From: jobollin@iumsc4.chem.indiana.edu (John Bollinger)
Subject: Re:  Orders template

I use the report itself for a template because I need all of the
information included there.  Personally, I find the template at the end of
the report totally useless.  In fact, I would be happy if I could specify
somehow that I didn't want the template added to my report.

I use an orders checker to save me from typing errors.

>I would like the template with the same information about my units
>as the turn report currently has.

In order to include all the information that would be necessary to make
the template useful to me, it would have to become a duplicate of the
main part of the report.  This would be a waste of time, effort, and
bandwidth.

>>What would really, really help me in the orders template is a listing of
>>SIL in each unit's comment.
>>
>>Actually, if you could recapitulate the unit description in the turn
>>report, that would be mondo and I would regale you as a god unto men until
>>my skull caved in from sheer exhaustion.

Indeed, I am interested in hearing whether other players find the template
useful, and if so, how they use it.

John Bollinger
Melvin's Marauders (105)