The Midgard Digest V1 #13 From: kerry@io.com (Kerry Harrison) Date: Fri, 01 Mar 1996 00:00:00 +0000 The Midgard Digest Friday, 1 March 1996 Volume 01 : Number 013 Welcome to the Midgard Digest, the place to discuss all the myriad aspects of life in the World of Midgard with its other denizens. In this issue: + MID: Excessive Quoting of Messages Problem + MID: City Sectors & Roads + RE: MID: Road Destruction + MID: Humorous Decrees + MID: More Road Destruction + Re[2]: MID: Road Destruction + Re: MID: City Sectors & Roads + MID: Roads + Re: MID: Fanglan + Re: MID: City Sectors & Roads + Re: MID: Fanglan + Re: MID: More Road Destruction + Re[2]: MID: Fanglan + Re: MID: Roads + Re[2]: MID: Road Destruction + Re: MID: Fanglan + MID: Road Kill + MID: Another road thought + Re: MID: Another road thought + MID: Response to Humor See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the midgard-list or midgard-digest mailing lists. For additional information on Midgard, check out the Official Midgard Home Page at http://www.comland.com/~pbm/midgard/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Kerry Harrison <kerry@io.com> Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 20:01:48 -0600 Subject: MID: Excessive Quoting of Messages Problem Folks, Please don't use excessive quoting (i.e. only quote the appropriate section of the message) and please, please don't including the entire message in your reply. Continued abuse of the above can result in this list going away. ------------------------------------------------------------ * Kerry Harrison | kerry@io.com | http://www.io.com/~kerry * ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ From: Kerry Harrison <kerry@io.com> Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 20:16:07 -0600 Subject: MID: City Sectors & Roads Here's what Zan had to say about city sectors and roads: The road sections are based on the number of roads that enter/exit the city... example is Cymeer has 3.. one ne, one west and one south. The land projects are within 5 of the city and have to be created by the city who counts them for his benefit. In clustered areas like Cymeer, Evanland, Banz, there is some overlapping, but all is correct with Cymeer's numbers. Water sections are those sections directly adjacent to the city. ------------------------------------------------------------ * Kerry Harrison | kerry@io.com | http://www.io.com/~kerry * ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ From: "Petonak, Paul M'bio" <paulp@microbio.LIFESCI.UCLA.EDU> Date: Wed, 28 Feb 96 20:26:00 PST Subject: RE: MID: Road Destruction If 10 meters is destroyed every 100 meters, would the cost of going around that 10 meters outweigh the benefit of moving on 100 meters of road? As far as trying to get 50 % of the material you would have to rip up at least 80% of the road. My opinion for the cost destruction / destruction with material gathering would be a minimum of 10% / 50% but 30% / 80% probably be better. Jerre -- Split it with a pick, crumble it with a chisel, and then smash it to pieces with a sledge hammer. What do you have? A million granules that all look the same. You guys seem to be going way off the deep end in analyzing this. PJP ------------------------------ From: "Petonak, Paul M'bio" <paulp@microbio.LIFESCI.UCLA.EDU> Date: Wed, 28 Feb 96 22:52:00 PST Subject: MID: Humorous Decrees I realize just about everyone has probably written everything that needs to be said in these responses to the Imperial decrees but a few items struck me as interesting and no one elaborated on it so .... I think the Imperial seniors need to consider what some of the actual in game consequences are to the decrees they have issued. Imperial Quote in Decree 2 or 3 or .... (not sure) is anyone really keeping track? <First, it should be known that the MercVerk are guilty of two seperate offenses. The first is the burning of the Imperial Legate at Fanglan. The immediate seizure of 3 Merc Verk Cities is the penalty for interfering with Imperial property.> God man, what happens if someone actually meant it? Are we to assume that in any seige or assault if a Legate happens to be at ground-zero of a burning tar shot the attacking faction is to turn over some of it's cities to the Imperials? What do you have in these Legates anyway? Sounds like an excellent way to encourage cities to NOT build Legates. *** But most importantly: <In this instance, all MV clans and regiments involved at Fanglan will be arrested and tried for their actions. If found guilty, ... {assorted minutia} ... without penalty. Further, any and all MV Seniors who supervised and/or oversaw the Fanglan operation will also be arrested and tried.> As I know the Imperials are a very orderly faction I assume this will be standard policy for any similiar situation. Now, what does the above mean. 1) The Imperials need to determine the names of all clans present at this battle or any that played supportive or secondary roles. Also, they need to determine all regiments that were present in active or passive roles. As I am sure all seniors in any faction play some role in any proposed attack the Imperials at least do not need to determine which seniors are of interest. 2) The Imperials need to locate ALL of these people. 3) As I am _certain_ none of the MV are going to turn themselves in (I played with most of them for years) the Imps now need to build varying sizes of armies to track these people down. They also need to find clans to run the armies. -- Bear in mind that the Seniors to be arrested are highly experienced clans and are likely to have a significant amount of regulars attached all of a high caliber. 4) Even when the general area of the arrestee's is found they will need to be tracked until an exact location is known and the Imp force will have to react immediately before they move again. For anyone who who has never actually tracked a clan it is not very easy, one screw up and you are behind by a turn or two. Then (assuming they get this far) a battle insues, most likely the senior (or clan leader for that matter) will be able to get away and the Imps have to continue tracking. Wash, rinse, repeat. I've played in the game since 1987 (with a recent brief respite) and I have seen few clan leaders actually get killed in field battles and almost none captured. Meanwhile, as half to two thirds of the Imperial clan forces are chasing these guys down with maybe 30-40% of the factional retainer resources, Todeskampf lands at an Imperial city or fort and runs several thousand screaming barbarians through it. And amazingly, most of the Midgard political world cheers. I originally planned on making this post a little snappier but this entire concept is so silly that it is really not worth the effort. If the Imperials _really_ plan on doing this then I look forward to laughing at the results. By the way, I'll help you out a little. My former clan Psi Vladimir helped with the initial set-up at Fanglan. He's currently retired on the coasts of Southern Landend but if you have the extra clan you could send a few regiments by to pick him up to. To my erstwhile friends still in MV, fight on! I suspect the Third Harvest Uprising is right around the corner. PJP ------------------------------ From: PacHockey@aol.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 04:29:10 -0500 Subject: MID: More Road Destruction Just to throw in my 2 cents worth here...I love the idea of road destruction to disrupt trade and communications, but in all fairness to Mike, destroying roads is tough. To use Zan's Appian Way analogy, it wasn't made with jagged stones then a layer of gravel. It used (or is it uses since it is still around?) primarily dressed or semi-dressed stones mortared in place on a levelled road bed. Dirt and gravel mixed with mortar (or in later, Imperial stages asphalt from Palestine) was then packed down on top to form a firm, level surface. Time consuming to make, definitely. But not like pulling down drywall. Remember, no explosives--only muscle power. IMHO, destruction should require 50%, and salvage of materials 75% of building mancycles. Also, if you want total destruction (no movement bonus at all, maybe a negative) at least 60% of the mancycles. Let me know what you think... Steve ------------------------------ From: Mike_Williams@pc.radian.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 96 09:34:17 CDT Subject: Re[2]: MID: Road Destruction Thanks for (finally!) getting involved, Mike... <g> So, what's your opinion? Are you saying that you don't think there should be a "Destroy" order (at least for roads)? Keep in mind that a "destroyed" road would be easier by far to repair to good condition than building a road from scratch. I'm going to do some research over the weekend on "real" Roman roads and give a mini report on construction techniques. But until then, how would you handle road destruction in the rules? Not allow it at all, charge a certain percentage (of construction) or number of mancycles? Thanks for your input! mike ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: MID: Road Destruction Author: mjs@savanti.com (Mike Sutton) at INTERNET Date: 2/28/96 7:55 PM Okay, I promised myself I wasn't going to say anything, five times over, don't say anything, don't say anything... Sigh. It appears to me the major part of the activity to building a road in medieval times would be the leveling of the ground over which the road would pass, as well as possibility compacting and grading the roadbed. We ain't talking paving or even cobblestones here folks. In order to undo the above stated work, you would literally be redigging the trenches, or replacing the hillocks over which the road normally passes. In other words, once you have a road emplaced it is extremely difficult to destroy. You can do some work to plow up the roadbed, and perhaps destroy secondary infrastructure, such as bridges and culverts, but by and large the road would still be used by everybody, at the reduced movement rate. The fact of the matter is several thousand passing feet, hoofs and carts will rapidly undo most plowing attempts. Consider various Landsat photos from NASA. They still find roads buried from pre-Mesopotamian times that are essentially intact. In fact, many turn out to be used currently by bedouin caravans for the exact reasons stated above, these roads are still the best way across uneven or rolling landscape. My 2.78 cents worth. (At the current U.S. to Canadian exchange...) Mike Sutton ------------------------------ From: Mike_Williams@pc.radian.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 96 09:39:45 CDT Subject: Re: MID: City Sectors & Roads > The road sections are based on the number of roads that enter/exit the > city... example is Cymeer has 3.. one ne, one west and one south. I wonder though, is it possible for this rule to be abused by a city leader? I mean, couldn't he build half a dozen 1-sector-long roads running out of his city and receive substantial benefits? (Compared to a city leader who actually made sure all the roads leaving his city actually connected to nearby road networks, that is.) ------------------------------ From: SCHRADER@vaxd.sxu.edu Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 10:06:22 -0600 (CST) Subject: MID: Roads Perhaps, rather than focusing on the destruction of roads which I think is a fine idea but difficult to implement as everyone has elaborated on one could simply argue that over a 30 mile stretch of land, the road is likely to cross many streams, rivers, etc. some of which would be sufficiently deep to prevent horses and wagons from crossing (especially during wet seasons). Therefore, simply wiping out the relevant bridges would successfully accomplish what the Barbarians want with a lot less work (depending on the bridge of course). This may turn out to be a more feasible approach to the reality of the situation. Whatcha all think? Brian ------------------------------ From: Jay Seymour <jay.seymour@wichita.brite.com> Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 10:20:00 -0600 Subject: Re: MID: Fanglan Mercenaries? Or thieves? Wallenstein ---------- From: John & Alissa Pyrich To: Midgard-List Subject: Re: MID: Fanglan Date: Wednesday, February 28, 1996 3:43PM > The Serkeanar were an offshoot of the Blood and Fire, with a > mercenary tint with the addition of the SOA clans that joined. The > Serkeanar were a schism in the Blood and Fire, not vice versa. This goes equally as well for The Society of Arms. We have no religious ties. We are mercenaries. That is all. Kerin the Black ------------------------------ From: USAMIDGARD@aol.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 12:06:22 -0500 Subject: Re: MID: City Sectors & Roads In a message dated 96-02-29 09:56:59 EST, Mike Williams wrote: >I wonder though, is it possible for this rule to be abused by a city >leader? I mean, couldn't he build half a dozen 1-sector-long roads >running out of his city and receive substantial benefits? (Compared to a >city leader who actually made sure all the roads leaving his city >actually connected to nearby road networks, that is.) Abuse of any system is possible... system created to contain humans that is... however, you do have the ever vigilant GM who looks at each of these efforts as they happen and applies some logic, which says that the automated update is summarily squashed. And when I get the chance to look at all of the 72 map sections and review each city, then all the roads and linked cities will be correct... I love that asteroid! <g> (Then again, maybe another should hit around C-6 or D-6... think that might handle the road problem for a while?) Zan ------------------------------ From: "John & Alissa Pyrich" <pyrich@cris.com> Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 13:22:40 -5000 Subject: Re: MID: Fanglan > This goes equally as well for The Society of Arms. We have no > religious ties. We are mercenaries. That is all. > Mercenaries? Or thieves? This is a logical question. When the Serkeanar formed some regiments from the SOA joined the Serkeanar and some just walked away. When the SOA reformed, *only* the mercenary contingent came back. We no longer have any ties to the underworld. As I said before, we are pure mercenaries and plan to stay that way. Kerin the Black ------------------------------ From: Mike_Williams@pc.radian.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 96 11:53:34 CDT Subject: Re: MID: More Road Destruction > Just to throw in my 2 cents worth here...I love the idea of road > destruction to disrupt trade and communications, but in all fairness to > Mike, destroying roads is tough. To use Zan's Appian Way analogy, it > wasn't made with jagged stones then a layer of gravel. It used (or is it > uses since it is still around?) primarily dressed or semi-dressed stones > mortared in place on a levelled road bed. Dirt and gravel mixed with > mortar (or in later, Imperial stages asphalt from Palestine) was then > packed down on top to form a firm, level surface. Time consuming to make, > definitely. But not like pulling down drywall. Remember, no > explosives--only muscle power. One note on roads: read the description of them in the rulebook--I know next to nothing about the construction techniques required to build the Appian Way, but it sounds like the Romans were more advanced than Midgard's Imperials... <g> In other words, roads on Midgard are not as good as Appian Way roads, and so (?) might be easier to disrupt. > IMHO, destruction should require 50%, and salvage of materials 75% of > building mancycles. Also, if you want total destruction (no movement > bonus at all, maybe a negative) at least 60% of the mancycles. Let me > know what you think... I could live with these numbers! <g> ------------------------------ From: Mike_Williams@pc.radian.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 96 12:08:10 CDT Subject: Re[2]: MID: Fanglan > This goes equally as well for The Society of Arms. We have no > religious ties. We are mercenaries. That is all. > Kerin the Black Kerin, you dog you! Good to see you are active again. Contact me. I would like to put your faction to work... Todeskampf Great Destroyer Barbarian Lord ------------------------------ From: Mike_Williams@pc.radian.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 96 12:05:09 CDT Subject: Re: MID: Roads > Perhaps, rather than focusing on the destruction of roads which I think > is a fine idea but difficult to implement as everyone has elaborated on > one could simply argue that over a 30 mile stretch of land, the road is > likely to cross many streams, rivers, etc. some of which would be > sufficiently deep to prevent horses and wagons from crossing (especially > during wet seasons). Therefore, simply wiping out the relevant bridges > would successfully accomplish what the Barbarians want with a lot less > work (depending on the bridge of course). This may turn out to be a > more feasible approach to the reality of the situation. Whatcha all > think? I agree. So long as road disruption/destruction is possible (I can't wait to see what kind of map graphic Zan comes up with for a destroyed road... <g>), I'd be happy. And you're right, of course, about the bridges. There have to be at least a couple of big bridges to be encountered on a 30 mile stretch of road... ------------------------------ From: Mike_Williams@pc.radian.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 96 11:35:35 CDT Subject: Re[2]: MID: Road Destruction > -- Split it with a pick, crumble it with a chisel, and then smash it to > pieces with a sledge hammer. What do you have? A million granules that > all look the same. You guys seem to be going way off the deep end in > analyzing this. > PJP Yeah. Ain't it great? <g> ------------------------------ From: Jay Seymour <jay.seymour@wichita.brite.com> Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 13:33:00 -0600 Subject: Re: MID: Fanglan I'm glad to hear that. Wallenstien ---------- From: John & Alissa Pyrich To: Midgard-List Subject: Re: MID: Fanglan Date: Thursday, February 29, 1996 12:34PM > This goes equally as well for The Society of Arms. We have no > religious ties. We are mercenaries. That is all. > Mercenaries? Or thieves? This is a logical question. When the Serkeanar formed some regiments from the SOA joined the Serkeanar and some just walked away. When the SOA reformed, *only* the mercenary contingent came back. We no longer have any ties to the underworld. As I said before, we are pure mercenaries and plan to stay that way. Kerin the Black ------------------------------ From: SCHRADER@vaxd.sxu.edu Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 14:31:53 -0600 (CST) Subject: MID: Road Kill From: SMTP%"Mike_Williams@pc.radian.com" 29-FEB-1996 12:42:03.54 To: SCHRADER CC: Subj: Re: Roads From: Mike_Williams@pc.radian.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 96 12:00:38 CDT Encoding: 24 Text Message-Id: <9601298256.AA825618687@pc.radian.com> To: SCHRADER@vaxd.sxu.edu Subject: Re: Roads Hi Brian! Can you post your message to the list to let everyone know your views? The way it's looking now, your estimate of 50% seems to be what most people are leaning toward. I could live with that. <g> ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Roads Author: SCHRADER@vaxd.sxu.edu at INTERNET Date: 2/29/96 10:11 AM Mike, I do think road destruction is possible and would be easier than construction but not at a mere 10% rate. I would feel more comfortable with say 50%. The materials issue is kind of moot to be, I think that other than perhaps stone there's not much that would be salvageable. Besides are the Barbs really interested in hauling rock around? I support your Road Destruction I just think it may be tricky to implement as you have seen by the number of responses. Brian ------------------------------ From: J1WESCHAN@aol.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 17:18:54 -0500 Subject: MID: Another road thought The process of destruction, as described by Mike, was that the crew picked up picks and shovels etc.. So, the clan changes from TRV or whatever and changes to CNS (or DCNS) mode? Does the dirty deed and then must change modes again to TRV before moving on? This gives local clans/cities a small bit of time to respond, if able. Add to that the MP's to actually do this terrible thing, the bad guy may have to spend at least one turn in place. I think the actual destruction is well in character with Barbarian, but they were more hit and run in real life. John Chan ------------------------------ From: Mike_Williams@pc.radian.com Date: Thu, 29 Feb 96 18:21:59 CDT Subject: Re: MID: Another road thought > I think the actual destruction is well in character with Barbarian, but > they were more hit and run in real life. > John Chan Very true. In fact, there are very few instances of anyone in history ever having destroyed roads before... Bridges, yes, roads no. But barbarians in history did siege and take a lot of cities (Rome, too, eventually... <g>). They only did hit and runs when they didn't have a lot of troops and their enemy was more numerous/powerful. ------------------------------ From: SCHRADER@vaxd.sxu.edu Date: Fri, 1 Mar 1996 13:16:47 -0600 (CST) Subject: MID: Response to Humor From: SMTP%"paulp@microbio.LIFESCI.UCLA.EDU" 29-FEB-1996 01:04:00.15 To: SCHRADER CC: Subj: MID: Humorous Decrees From: "Petonak, Paul M'bio" <paulp@microbio.LIFESCI.UCLA.EDU> To: "'Midgard List'" <midgard-list@io.com> Subject: MID: Humorous Decrees Date: Wed, 28 Feb 96 22:52:00 PST Message-Id: <31354D49@smtpgate.lifesci.ucla.edu> Encoding: 100 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 Sender: owner-midgard-list@io.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: "Petonak, Paul M'bio" <paulp@microbio.LIFESCI.UCLA.EDU> I realize just about everyone has probably written everything that needs to be said in these responses to the Imperial decrees but a few items struck me as interesting and no one elaborated on it so .... I think the Imperial seniors need to consider what some of the actual in game consequences are to the decrees they have issued. <<<< We have >>>>> Imperial Quote in Decree 2 or 3 or .... (not sure) is anyone really keeping track? <First, it should be known that the MercVerk are guilty of two seperate offenses. The first is the burning of the Imperial Legate at Fanglan. The immediate seizure of 3 Merc Verk Cities is the penalty for interfering with Imperial property.> God man, what happens if someone actually meant it? Are we to assume that in any seige or assault if a Legate happens to be at ground-zero of a burning tar shot the attacking faction is to turn over some of it's cities to the Imperials? What do you have in these Legates anyway? Sounds like an excellent way to encourage cities to NOT build Legates. <<<<<<<<< If you deliberately damage Imperial property (or a deliberate action like starting a big fire, that would knowingly lead to damage) then YES there will be severe repurcussions similar to the ones from Fanglan (which also had massive civilian loss to compound the situation). And actually this is a good way of encouraging cities to build Legates since the city would be assured that the attackers would avoid the use of fire weapons to take the city unless the attackers were willing to gamble on possible Imperial intervention. A heck of a good insurance policy (except against Barbs/Bucs who don't care anyway). Furthermore, Imperial Legates provide a big boost in the quick response of a city's crisis index back to higher values and eventual stabilization after some city crisis like a siege or failed attack on the city. The conclusion I would draw is that if you're going to attack a city, be sure not to damage Imperial property (or least take reasonable precautions to prevent this from happening) and don't unnecessarily endanger the civilian populace (like burning the city down on top of them). I really don't see these two restrictions as major impedi- ments to a successful attack on a city. Plus, you'll be assured the Imperials won't get involved by abiding by them. >>>>>>>>>>> *** But most importantly: <In this instance, all MV clans and regiments involved at Fanglan will be arrested and tried for their actions. If found guilty, ... {assorted minutia} ... without penalty. Further, any and all MV Seniors who supervised and/or oversaw the Fanglan operation will also be arrested and tried.> As I know the Imperials are a very orderly faction I assume this will be standard policy for any similiar situation. Now, what does the above mean. 1) The Imperials need to determine the names of all clans present at this battle or any that played supportive or secondary roles. Also, they need to determine all regiments that were present in active or passive roles. As I am sure all seniors in any faction play some role in any proposed attack the Imperials at least do not need to determine which seniors are of interest. <<<<<<< Clans are sufficient since they give the orders to the Regiments. And the Battle Report should give me all the info I need on who was there. Seniors need merely to openly banish those clans which violate their orders to show that they did not approve of what happened. >>>>>>>> 2) The Imperials need to locate ALL of these people. <<<<<<<< Perhaps you've missed the finer subtlety here. If the offending faction wants to avoid the Imperial repurcussions then THEY will round up the guilty parties. If they don't, the faction gets punished since the Seniors obviously approve. >>>>>>>> 3) As I am _certain_ none of the MV are going to turn themselves in (I played with most of them for years) the Imps now need to build varying sizes of armies to track these people down. They also need to find clans to run the armies. -- Bear in mind that the Seniors to be arrested are highly experienced clans and are likely to have a significant amount of regulars attached all of a high caliber. <<<<<<<<< See above point. If the faction opts to save their guilty clans then they forfeit the cities in return. Its their choice. Either way rules are enforced. If the punishment is severe enough, factions won't engage in little fiascos like Fanglan now will they?! That way their clans and cities remain intact. 4) Even when the general area of the arrestee's is found they will need to be tracked until an exact location is known and the Imp force will have to react immediately before they move again. For anyone who who has never actually tracked a clan it is not very easy, one screw up and you are behind by a turn or two. Then (assuming they get this far) a battle insues, most likely the senior (or clan leader for that matter) will be able to get away and the Imps have to continue tracking. Wash, rinse, repeat. I've played in the game since 1987 (with a recent brief respite) and I have seen few clan leaders actually get killed in field battles and almost none captured. Meanwhile, as half to two thirds of the Imperial clan forces are chasing these guys down with maybe 30-40% of the factional retainer resources, Todeskampf lands at an Imperial city or fort and runs several thousand screaming barbarians through it. And amazingly, most of the Midgard political world cheers. <<<<<<<< Again see my above 2 points. The Imperials avoid all this chasing scenario. Cities can't run away. Hopefully, now you are realizing that I HAVE thought this through and perhaps YOU have not seen the finer points. I've played since '91 so I'm not exactly a rookie either but then even experienced players can learn a thing or two as I have illustrated above. >>>>>>>>> I originally planned on making this post a little snappier but this entire concept is so silly that it is really not worth the effort. <<<<<<<<< Apparently it was worth the effort since you wrote it and sent it. >>>>>>>>> If the Imperials _really_ plan on doing this then I look forward to laughing at the results. <<<<<<<<< I'm glad you and apparently others find it amusing. A couple of points here. First, I have a great time role-playing the Imperials and Lord Palan Tark within the confines of the factional goals. Its the best part of the game and why I like playing it. If you can't appreciate the efforts then its your loss. But it has definitely sparked the game and signaled the return of the Imperials after a long absence/dormancy. Its also gotten a lot of people talking via this e-mail List which I think is also good for the game (even if it turns out to be bad for the Imperials). Second, someone once said something like..... "one mocks one what does not understand" and "Belittling one's opponent is the last desparate act of a beaten man". I hope the other factions keep laughing. Third, so far all has been talk; we shall see who stands and falls in future cycles. >>>>>>>>>>> By the way, I'll help you out a little. My former clan Psi Vladimir helped with the initial set-up at Fanglan. He's currently retired on the coasts of Southern Landend but if you have the extra clan you could send a few regiments by to pick him up to. <<<<<<<<<<< Thanks but the Imperials have grown immensely since a major restructuring occurred. We have plenty of clans, regiments, crowns, cities, backing from homeland/allies alike, and stamina for any fights. Your services are not required. New recruits are bountiful. >>>>>>>>>>> To my erstwhile friends still in MV, fight on! I suspect the Third Harvest Uprising is right around the corner. <<<<<<<<<<< Perhaps it is. But the Imperials stand ready as does the Homeland. >>>>>>>>>>> PJP <<<<<<< Brian >>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------ End of The Midgard Digest V1 #13 ******************************** To subscribe to The Midgard Digest, send the command: subscribe midgard-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@io.com" To unsubscribe from The Midgard Digest send the command: unsubscribe midgard-digest in the body of a message to "majordomo@io.com" If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe "local-midgard-list": subscribe midgard-digest local-mid-list@your.domain.net A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "midgard-digest" in the commands above with "midgard-list". Up